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USO 2015: The Finale

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USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sat Sep 12, 2015 9:24 am

Though never hyped like Fedal, I always thought Federer-Djokovic matches were more interesting and of higher quality.

As Federer said in his interview last night - neither have to adjust much to each other - it's a straightforward shoot-out.

And though straight shoot-outs from the base-line can get monotonous, the occasional dynamic animosity and history of these two generally made up for lack of maybe some more exquisite creating.

They have played many big matches, and often there was something more than the title to play for: first slam, the streak, number two ranking, number one ranking...

Who can forget RG11 SF or The "Lucky" Shot?

Bottom line, we have game's best attacker and defender here - both in their prime: Nole - physical, Fed - game.

And they have both used the best they have to take their games to respective extremes: Nole to get to ungettable balls, Fed to take the ball as early as possible.

They come to the final as fresh as they could've realistically hoped for, though Nole's had an unbelievably easy run, esp with injured Cilic last night.

Federer on the other hand, avoided Murray and preserved as much energy he could've under the circumstances.

As far as I could see, Nole actually did not get challenged at all so far and will struggle to get used to fast pace Federer will throw at him. Especially on this faster surface, and even more - with the crowd against him.


I see Federer making the most of that initial advantage and taking the first, maybe even the second set.

And then the real match will begin as Nole will refuse to go without kicking and screaming.
Fed's serving will be crucial.

Also, his taking the ball super early and flattening the FH will definitely make Nole nervous.

I still remember their first final here in 2007. And no, it doesn't look like it was yesterday...



Last edited by noleisthebest on Sat Sep 12, 2015 10:21 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sat Sep 12, 2015 9:57 am

noleisthebest wrote:
As far as I could see, he actually did not get challenged at all so far and will struggle to get used to fast pace Federer will throw at him. Especially in this faster surface, and even more - with the crowd against him.

The pace of the court isn't bothering Djoko, nor the crowd. My only hope is that Lopez' s&v'ing did cause some problems for Djoko. But i expect a different Djoko, he knows so well how to handle Federer in a slam match.

During the on court interview after the semi Federer almost looked depressed when the interviewer talked about Djokovic. It's was really striking..

I guess Edberg will watch the Wimbledon and Cinci final today. There must be a explanation why those finals went like that. I'm afraid a lot of it is mindgames. Djoko and Fed know Fed can win in 2 and maybe 3, Djoko and Fed know Fed can't win in 4 or 5. That makes Djoko being the hunted in Bo3 and Fed in Bo5.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sat Sep 12, 2015 10:02 am

gallery play wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
As far as I could see, he actually did not get challenged at all so far and will struggle to get used to fast pace Federer will throw at him. Especially in this faster surface, and even more - with the crowd against him.

The pace of the court isn't bothering Djoko, nor the crowd. My only hope is that Lopez' s&v'ing did cause some problems for Djoko. But i expect a different Djoko, he knows so well how to handle Federer in a slam match.

During the on court interview after the semi Federer almost looked depressed when the interviewer talked about Djokovic. It's was really striking..
It did bother him in Cinci. And Agut who has a nice flat FH, but nothing on Fed's did make him run and struggle with footwork.
Out of curiosity, how do you think Cinci match would've gone if it was played best if 5?

Yes, I also noticed Fed almost wince when he talked about the final...same as in Wimbledon.
PS
I just threw in the "crowd" for the sake of it Winking
I know he's got used to it...esp in NY

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sat Sep 12, 2015 10:30 am

gallery play wrote:I guess Edberg will watch the Wimbledon and Cinci final today. There must be a explanation why those finals went like that. I'm afraid a lot of it is mindgames. Djoko and Fed know Fed can win in 2 and maybe 3, Djoko and Fed know Fed can't win in 4 or 5. That makes Djoko being the hunted in Bo3 and Fed in Bo5.
I really don't see it that way. The only mind game for fed is knowing that he has to finish in 3 or 4 because it is actually physical.

The reason Fed lost Wimby is simply because he was tired. he may be tired now again but he made a bloody good effort to arrive relatively fresh in that final. Plus a steady bounce will give him better confidence. I am just amazed at Djoko's pace on the court though clearly cilic made him look better than he probably is.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sat Sep 12, 2015 10:48 am

Tenez wrote:I am just amazed at Djoko's pace on the court though clearly cilic made him look better than he probably is.
Yes, that will be his weapon, though he's had it since Wimbledon 2014.
Now that he's added mass to his biceps and shoulders, it's more pronounced.

The real danger is that he doesn't need to go for the lines with it, so quite low risk, though he has excellent length.

He has perfected those shots down the middle which is a smart tactic against shot-makers.

I don't mind it like that but I really disliked when he used it to hammer Fed's BH in Wimbledon final esp as he piled it on when Fed was already tired. A completely unnecessary show of force, but with a clear message for the future.
It was awful to watch.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sat Sep 12, 2015 3:52 pm

Men's final starts at 12.00 local time tomorrow.
Weather forecast:

http://www.bbc.com/weather/5128581

We could have rain interruptions.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sat Sep 12, 2015 4:39 pm

Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:I guess Edberg will watch the Wimbledon and Cinci final today. There must be a explanation why those finals went like that. I'm afraid a lot of it is mindgames. Djoko and Fed know Fed can win in 2 and maybe 3, Djoko and Fed know Fed can't win in 4 or 5. That makes Djoko being the hunted in Bo3 and Fed in Bo5.
I really don't see it that way. The only mind game for fed is knowing that he has to finish in 3 or 4 because it is actually physical.

But that's exactly what i'm saying..
Winning in 4...pfew tough task

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sat Sep 12, 2015 4:43 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
gallery play wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
As far as I could see, he actually did not get challenged at all so far and will struggle to get used to fast pace Federer will throw at him. Especially in this faster surface, and even more - with the crowd against him.

The pace of the court isn't bothering Djoko, nor the crowd. My only hope is that Lopez' s&v'ing did cause some problems for Djoko. But i expect a different Djoko, he knows so well how to handle Federer in a slam match.

During the on court interview after the semi Federer almost looked depressed when the interviewer talked about Djokovic. It's was really striking..
It did bother him in Cinci. And Agut who has a nice flat FH, but nothing on Fed's did make him run and struggle with footwork.
Out of curiosity, how do you think Cinci match would've gone if it was played best if 5?

Yes, I also noticed Fed almost wince when he talked about the final...same as in Wimbledon.
PS
I just threw in the "crowd" for the sake of it Winking
I know he's got used to it...esp in NY
I think Djoko would have won.. because it changes their mindset. Both do start different when it's Bo5. It's a safe position for Djoko, hence Roger's wincing..

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sat Sep 12, 2015 7:29 pm

Well Djoko is the clear favourite. Fed lost 2 5 setters here having even 2 MPS in each. At 34 a 5 setter is not an option.

Fed will have to win in 3.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sat Sep 12, 2015 11:03 pm

Federer asked the crowd the support him... o boy, he's desperate.
Djoko will feel mentally so strong

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Daniel on Sun Sep 13, 2015 12:06 am

It depends which Federer shows up.  Federer v Wawrinka shows up and it's 60% Fed.  Wimbledon final Fed shows up and it's 80% Djokovic.  Federer has to keep the serve, above all else.  It's been the case towards tail end of his career that he has disaster service games that cost him.  He almost had one against Wawrinka, but then turned it round. His serve against Wawrinka was more or less rock solid. He can't afford to have 50% first serve in against Djokovic.  needs to be in the 60s.

Federer can definitely do it, if he brings his best. And by best, I mean current best.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by bogbrush on Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:40 am

The real key is Djokovic's serve and Federer's return. He needs at least 4/5 breaks.

The problem is age, and knowing that he's under pressure to keep points brief and win in four at most.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:06 am

I think the problem is combination of Djokovic's fitness and the advantage/safety his DBH gives him.
It's almost fool-proof.

Fed's only hope is the surface that can help him take time away from Nole.

It's going to be tough to sustain it over the best of 5, and big pressure on Fed's serve, but if anyone can do it - he can!

I hope he was able to reenergise and refresh his body to give him a powerful start.

He's got to win the first set fast.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:13 am

There are going to be many keys actually:

Federer's serve, Djoko's return, Fed's volleys, Federer's BH, etc....Fed and Djoko fitness. Sure Djoko's is much better but should he get breathless and nervous....the crowd, etc....

Above all for Fed it's all about excution. For Djoko..it's also all about Fed's execution.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:22 am

Tenez wrote:There are going to be many keys actually:

Federer's serve, Djoko's return, Fed's volleys, Federer's BH, etc....Fed and Djoko fitness. Sure Djoko's is much better but should he get breathless and nervous....the crowd, etc....

Above all for Fed it's all about excution. For Djoko..it's also all about Fed's execution.

Yes, that's what I thought.
But the crowd will only get to him when he starts losing. He has learnt how to live with it.

A very interesting match because Fed finally has the surface to back him in a slam after a long time... for me it's 55/45.

He'll through everything in the ring, moreso than in Wimbledon.

Could be an epic match.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:48 am

noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:There are going to be many keys actually:

Federer's serve, Djoko's return, Fed's volleys, Federer's BH, etc....Fed and Djoko fitness. Sure Djoko's is much better but should he get breathless and nervous....the crowd, etc....

Above all for Fed it's all about excution. For Djoko..it's also all about Fed's execution.

Yes, that's what I thought.
But the crowd will only get to him when he starts losing. He has learnt how to live with it.
.

Sadly I might miss the match as I will be driving back from Leeds.

I am not sure we can get used to playing against a 20k crowd. So far only Federer managed to get through it v Agassi. I suspect the crowd played a great role in their 2013 final.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by bogbrush on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:43 am

Which 2013 final?

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:03 am

Tenez wrote:Sadly I might miss the match as I will be driving back from Leeds.
Sad
Tenez wrote:
I am not sure we can get used to playing against a 20k crowd. So far only Federer managed to get through it v Agassi. I suspect the crowd played a great role in their 2013 final.
Though I only saw first fee games I know it did. It was awful.
RG11 SF, too.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:06 am

bogbrush wrote:Which 2013 final?
Wimbledon.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sun Sep 13, 2015 12:46 pm

I found the way the US audience treated Vinci after she beat Serena was outstanding.
Nevertheless, i think they should fully support Federer tonight. It may be the last time they see a legend like that.
Any non-Serbian who cheers for Djoko cannot be trusted or does not have a soul smiley

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sun Sep 13, 2015 12:53 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:There are going to be many keys actually:

Federer's serve, Djoko's return, Fed's volleys, Federer's BH, etc....Fed and Djoko fitness. Sure Djoko's is much better but should he get breathless and nervous....the crowd, etc....

Above all for Fed it's all about excution. For Djoko..it's also all about Fed's execution.

Yes, that's what I thought.
But the crowd will only get to him when he starts losing. He has learnt how to live with it.

A very interesting match because Fed finally has the surface to back him in a slam after a long time... for me it's 55/45.

He'll through everything in the ring, moreso than in Wimbledon.

Could be an epic match.

55/45 favoring whom?

Why now throwing more than he did in Wimbledon?

If it becomes an 'epic', Djoko almost certainly wins. Fed can only win if the match lacks any kind of rhythm (read: 2-4 shot rallies only). With a few sneaky breaks at the right time.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:19 pm

gallery play wrote:
55/45 favoring whom?
"Djoko"
gallery play wrote:
Why now throwing more than he did in Wimbledon?
Because he is fresher and playing better tennis than in Wimbledon due to the court which gives him fast, even-bouncing virtually indoor conditions. And he's beaten him convincingly in Cinci.
He knows he can't get into Nole's head as in the early days, quite the opposite (hence the wincing), so it will truly have to be a "straight-forward shootout" as he knows it's best of 5. No mind games whatsoever.
gallery play wrote:
If it becomes an 'epic', Djoko almost certainly wins. Fed can only win if the match lacks any kind of rhythm (read: 2-4 shot rallies only). With a few sneaky breaks at the right time.
Maybe.
Fed fought like a lion in Wimbledon to the end. He will do the same here.
With the above mentioned advantages over Wimbledon, I think his fight will be meaningful even in the 4th set.
This court is challenging for Nole's footwork, so he'll tire faster than in Wimbledon. Especially if Fed is able to play his tennis in the first two set.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by luvsports! on Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:59 pm

I am so nervous Sad

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:00 pm

Are we ready to RRRRRAMBLEEEEEE!!!!!!?

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by AceofDeath on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:04 pm

Ready to gulp Laugh

Good luck to both.. Hold me

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:05 pm

Rain!!!!

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:08 pm

I have no commentary stream, do we know how long the delay may last?

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:10 pm

bogbrush wrote:Which 2013 final?
I meant the one between Nadal and Djoko (USO)

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:12 pm

Tenez wrote:
bogbrush wrote:Which 2013 final?
I meant the one between Nadal and Djoko (USO)
It can't've been as bad as Wimbledon'13!

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:15 pm

AceofDeath wrote:Ready to gulp Laugh

Good luck to both.. Hold me
Hello Jahu!

Good luck to both? You must be kidding. I want Djoko to get a thunderbolts while he stretches to retrieve an unretrievable so he can be immortalised in that position for the generations to come.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:16 pm

An announcement coming through on Ashe but I couldn't understand it.
The crowd seemed to like it.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:16 pm

Tenez wrote:
AceofDeath wrote:Ready to gulp Laugh

Good luck to both.. Hold me
Hello Jahu!

Good luck to both? You must be kidding. I want Djoko to get a thunderbolts while he stretches to retrieve an unretrievable so he can be immortalised in that position for the generations to come.  
Laugh

perfect! win win situation

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:18 pm

Tenez wrote:
AceofDeath wrote:Ready to gulp Laugh

Good luck to both.. Hold me
Hello Jahu!

Good luck to both? You must be kidding. I want Djoko to get a thunderbolts while he stretches to retrieve an unretrievable so he can be immortalised in that position for the generations to come.  
Ace of Death is Jahu!!!!?

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:18 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:
bogbrush wrote:Which 2013 final?
I meant the one between Nadal and Djoko (USO)
It can't've been as bad as Wimbledon'13!
Oh yeah...nothing like the US crowd. Just chewing burgers they make more noise than a brazilian football crowd. And they are 20k!

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by luvsports! on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:19 pm

10.30 i heard!

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:19 pm

noleisthebest wrote:An announcement coming through on Ashe but I couldn't understand it.
The crowd seemed to like it.
There will be a decision at 22:30, that's 21:30 for you.
But if they decide to play, it takes another 30 minutes before they can come out.

Damn, i won't see the end of this match

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:19 pm

Tenez wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:
bogbrush wrote:Which 2013 final?
I meant the one between Nadal and Djoko (USO)
It can't've been as bad as Wimbledon'13!
Oh yeah...nothing like the US crowd. Just chewing burgers they make more noise than a brazilian football crowd. And they are 20k!
I didn't watch that match either... Yikes

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:22 pm

Yes that's a shame.....though ideally the match should be played tomorrow. It's give Federer an extra day rest.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:23 pm

gallery play wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:An announcement coming through on Ashe but I couldn't understand it.
The crowd seemed to like it.
There will be a decision at 22:30, that's 21:30 for you.
But if they decide to play, it takes another 30 minutes before they can come out.

Damn, i won't see the end of this match
I'm in France atm, so 22.30 for me, too.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:23 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:
AceofDeath wrote:Ready to gulp Laugh

Good luck to both.. Hold me
Hello Jahu!

Good luck to both? You must be kidding. I want Djoko to get a thunderbolts while he stretches to retrieve an unretrievable so he can be immortalised in that position for the generations to come.  
Ace of Death is Jahu!!!!?
Thought so....but I might mix things up.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:24 pm

Tenez wrote:Yes that's a shame.....though ideally the match should be played tomorrow. It's give Federer an extra day rest.
I wouldn't mind.
Another People's Monday champion Winking

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by luvsports! on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:24 pm

He hates Djoko, he wouldn;'t wish him luck.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:26 pm

luvsports! wrote:He hates Djoko, he wouldn;'t wish him luck.
And he wouldn't have the guts to show his face here Winking

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:27 pm

Another interesting edition of "the coach" (Patrick Mouratoglou) in Game Set Mats.

He pointed out it was Fed's second slice serve which killed him at Wimbledon. The second -kick- serve he usually hits on HC proved to be much more effective in Cinci.
Fed also did not return very well in the Wimbledon final, whereas it's the talk of the town since Cinci, and not only the SABR.
Fed was almost 2 yards (average) inside the court on Stan's second serve, and 1 yard on the first. On grass that's hard to do, if not impossible.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:30 pm

gallery play wrote:Another interesting edition of "the coach" (Patrick Mouratoglou) in Game Set Mats.

He pointed out it was Fed's second slice serve which killed him at Wimbledon. The second -kick- serve he usually hits on HC proved to be much more effective in Cinci.
Fed also did not return very well in the Wimbledon final, whereas it's the talk of the town since Cinci, and not only the SABR.
Fed was almost 2 yards (average) inside the court on Stan's second serve, and 1 yard on the first. On grass that's hard to do, if not impossible.

yes it is genrally easier to return on HC...but the wind (or lack of rather) is the main factor to take the ball early....as you can imagine.

Tenez

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by Tenez on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:35 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
luvsports! wrote:He hates Djoko, he wouldn;'t wish him luck.
And he wouldn't have the guts to show his face here Winking
It's Josiah! I knew there was a J. Winking

Welcome back Josiah.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by gallery play on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:36 pm

Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:Another interesting edition of "the coach" (Patrick Mouratoglou) in Game Set Mats.

He pointed out it was Fed's second slice serve which killed him at Wimbledon. The second -kick- serve he usually hits on HC proved to be much more effective in Cinci.
Fed also did not return very well in the Wimbledon final, whereas it's the talk of the town since Cinci, and not only the SABR.
Fed was almost 2 yards (average) inside the court on Stan's second serve, and 1 yard on the first. On grass that's hard to do, if not impossible.

yes it is genrally easier to return on HC...but the wind (or lack of rather) is the main factor to take the ball early....as you can imagine.

Do you think he's in a better position than in the Wimbledon final?

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:40 pm

Tenez wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
luvsports! wrote:He hates Djoko, he wouldn;'t wish him luck.
And he wouldn't have the guts to show his face here Winking
It's Josiah! I knew there was a J. Winking

Welcome back Josiah.
Yes.
I think Jahu is Nameless from bbc606.

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by noleisthebest on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:43 pm

luvsports! wrote:I am so nervous Sad
Me, too!
I have already eaten all the snack food I prepared for the match Yikes

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

Post by luvsports! on Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:46 pm

It's great to see you have seen the light and left the dark side of the force nitb Big Grin

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Re: USO 2015: The Finale

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