Gerry Webber Open Halle & Queens

That was proper shite.

Getting bullied on the baseline by freaking Coric - a pusher.

I wouldn't wanna see what happens against Djokovic in week 2 of the slow W courts.

He's had his serve broken so many times in the last 2 weeks.

I wouldn’t get too stressed, he’s played lengthy matches on successive days and two events in two weeks, so a week off and back to alternate days matches will be much better for him.

Only Djoko loss today, can compensate this loss 

Coric is much improved from prior years, even from earlier this year.  He, unlike some other kids, also always looks quite focused - no temper tantrums.

I never thought of him as a grass court player, but he will be dangerous at Wimbledon if he can keep this up.

Fed was okish, not great.  I expect he will be better at Wimbledon, butt we shall see.

Fed won 97 points, Coric 89. Not even close. And yet it was not enough. Fed was too passive on many of the big points.

Emancipator wrote:Getting bullied on the baseline by freaking Coric - a pusher.

Coric has improved immensely though.  Would be interesting to see average pace of his ground strokes today compare to even IW/Miami.  I have never seen him hit with that much pace.

Also, let's face it, Djoko is also a bit of a pusher, and it got him 12 slams.  Coric can at least play at the net.

Coric was hitting a lot of solid deep shots today.  I am not quite with Tenez and am not going to suggest he was as good as peak Nole, but he was quite good.

This is the third painful loss this year: Delpotro, Kokkinakis and now Coric!!!!

They all sucked in their own way...but all had the same thing in common: Fed's tired legs.

Hopefully he'll be able to get away with his age in Wimbledon with day's rest(s).

Ok lets agree, maybe as good as Andy's peek 

Happy for Coric, his only second win in a Final. Looks like a quiet well-behaved guy.

Come on Cilicccc, crush himmmmmmmmm

Fed looked really tired at the end. He is a bit like Nadal nowadays.....he has to win everything in 2 or in 3 in slams.

Bit unlucky! not to have won it in 2....but this showed his fragility over the distance again.

noleisthebest wrote:This is the third painful loss this year: Delpotro, Kokkinakis and now Coric!!!!

They all sucked in their own way...but all had the same thing in common: Fed's tired legs.

Hopefully he'll be able to get away with his age in Wimbledon with day's rest(s).

This is his third loss of the year too.  I think he will be fine at Wimbledon but maybe I was right that he should have tanked Halle.

It will be funny if Fed fails to win Halle but Djokovic wins Queens.

Becker in the crowd, came to suck a little money from Djoko to pay his bankruptcy debts.

nole's looking better on grass than he did on clay, less energy sapping for him.
Moves and returns quite well.
Title in Queens would be just what the doctor ordered for his confidence.

Wow, that was an amazing point for 40:00!

Stats confirming Cilic is pushed back on his service games.
I don't think he's ever beaten Nole.

Nole is looking pretty impressive.

Just like Fed, Nole throws his TB away.

I hope he crushes gorilla Cilic in the 3rd. He just gets on my nerves with his ugly faces and boring tennis.

All that in your face fistpumping and cried like a baby vs Fed last summer....

Cilic's mum must still be visiting that pharmacist.

Nole has made him run loads and Cilic still looking fresh despite the weight and size he is carrying around.

The court at Queens looks in a much better state than Halle.

Is that the camera angle or Coric was hitting harder than Nole?

Oh that was 2 very nervous shots from Djoko. It doesn;t matter how many slams you have won....when one lacks confidence, it s difficult to get it back.

Good win for Cilic.

First 2 sets probably the worst of this year.

Third much better.

Tenez wrote:Is that the camera angle or Coric was hitting harder than Nole?

What you mean? Djoko shots had half the power that Coric had today.

Has Cilic finally become better than the RRunners? Now that he is 29 he seems able to have the confidence and knowledge to beat those guys.

Jahu wrote:

Tenez wrote:Is that the camera angle or Coric was hitting harder than Nole?

What you mean? Djoko shots had half the power that Coric had today.

It looked to me to be the case but I would have liked to have the view of someones slightly less partial when it comes to Nole than you!

So the 27+ is the age now where tennis players get real and mature.

Tenez wrote:

Jahu wrote:

Tenez wrote:Is that the camera angle or Coric was hitting harder than Nole?

What you mean? Djoko shots had half the power that Coric had today.

It looked to me to be the case but I would have liked to have the view of someones slightly less partial when it comes to Nole than you!

You're so modest 

Tenez wrote:Has Cilic finally become better than the RRunners? Now that he is 29 he seems able to have the confidence and knowledge to beat those guys.

He was certainly the more clutch player today. 

No one can retrieve his best shots. He just needs to string those together at the right time. Like he did today.

Wow.  I could only watch midway through the second set.  Did not see this result coming.  Very much against the flow of play.  Cilic looked the better player in the first set but he lost it.  In the second set while I was watching, Nole looked better and Cilic was barely hanging on.

Still, this was the best I have seen Nole play in a while.  It was not sexy, but he was scampering around the baseline like in the bad old times.  He could be dangerous at Wimbledon.  Cilic may well be the 2nd best grass courter right now, and Nole almost beat him.

gallery play wrote:

Tenez wrote:Has Cilic finally become better than the RRunners? Now that he is 29 he seems able to have the confidence and knowledge to beat those guys.

He was certainly the more clutch player today. 

No one can retrieve his best shots. He just needs to string those together at the right time. Like he did today.

Yeah.  Take Cilic's game and Delpo's nerves and you have some player.

Glad you notice because Marin's without a doubt the most underrated player on OTF

summerblues wrote:Croatia could have two winners today.  And their soccer team is doing well too.  Good times.

They did it.  This must be the first time ever Croats won two ATP titles the same week?  Now, while that is all fine, I hope we will not have Coric vs Cilic in the Wimbledon final.

gallery play wrote:Glad you notice because Marin's without a doubt the most underrated player on OTF

Oh, not with me.  I said last year that when Delpo and Cilic had first come out, I thought they were kind of similar but Cilic the better of the two (even though for a long time it did not pan out that way).  And I remember somebody (maybe even you?) agreeing with me.

noleisthebest wrote:ABC

I think I figured this out.    Really, should have been obvious to me right away.

gallery play wrote:Glad you notice because Marin's without a doubt the most underrated player on OTF

There must be a reason for that.

His game was not bad when he turned up, he had nice movement played all-court tennis.

Then he beefed up and started playing flairless percentage tennis entrenched on the baseline + making those ugly faces.

Now his timing has matured, he gained confidence in the absence of big 4 last two years and he is a dangerous player.

I just don't like watching him.

summerblues wrote:

gallery play wrote:Glad you notice because Marin's without a doubt the most underrated player on OTF

Oh, not with me.  I said last year that when Delpo and Cilic had first come out, I thought they were kind of similar but Cilic the better of the two (even though for a long time it did not pan out that way).  And I remember somebody (maybe even you?) agreeing with me.

I think they are not that alike. Delpo is -despite his power- a point constructor. Marin can't wait to pull the trigger: it's his strength but also his weakness. 

They differ 6 days in age but to me Delpo is a player of the past and Marin a potential slam winner for upcoming years.

noleisthebest wrote:

gallery play wrote:Glad you notice because Marin's without a doubt the most underrated player on OTF

There must be a reason for that.

His game was not bad when he turned up, he had nice movement played all-court tennis.

Then he beefed up and started playing flairless percentage tennis entrenched on the baseline + making those ugly faces.

Now his timing has matured, he gained confidence in the absence of big 4 last two years and he is a dangerous player.

I just don't like watching him.

no way! Marin certainly doesn't play percentage tennis. He always hits loads of winners/ue's

gallery play wrote:
no way! Marin certainly doesn't play percentage tennis. He always hits loads of winners/ue's

I saw him beat Fabio in RG in 5 sets, from quite close up...and he looked percentage compared to Fabio... Cilic didn't outplay, but outmuscled him. In fact, some idiot yelled out during Fabio's both first and second serve when he was advantage down, so he double-faulted and lost.

Cilic's  game is now based on heavily physical safe-ish shots.
There is nothing subtle there, just raw spin. That's the missing link for me. I don't like any one of his shots in particular. His used to have a nice flat inside out FH in the early days.
Now, he is almost as physical as Nadal in a way.

He has obviously found a way to play like that within himself and win.

But not the kind of player I'd ever get up to watch in the middle of the night.

To me, he was a lot more watchable when he was young and just starting, moved like a panther.

well, fed tried to keep number one but he couldnt

we will soon see if this effort was for good or not

noleisthebest wrote:

gallery play wrote:
no way! Marin certainly doesn't play percentage tennis. He always hits loads of winners/ue's

I saw him beat Fabio in RG in 5 sets, from quite close up...and he looked percentage compared to Fabio... Cilic didn't outplay, but outmuscled him. In fact, some idiot yelled out during Fabio's both first and second serve when he was advantage down, so he double-faulted and lost.

Cilic's  game is now based on heavily physical safe-ish shots.
There is nothing subtle there, just raw spin. That's the missing link for me. I don't like any one of his shots in particular. His used to have a nice flat inside out FH in the early days.
Now, he is almost as physical as Nadal in a way.

He has obviously found a way to play like that within himself and win.

But not the kind of player I'd ever get up to watch in the middle of the night.

To me, he was a lot more watchable when he was young and just starting, moved like a panther.

I also think he lacks subtility and finesse. It's not a player with great variety,  nor is he aesthetically pleasing to the eye. His shot selection is quite edgy too.

But...he is one of the very very few players out there who can hit through the RR's and that's good enough for me.

I just saw the photo from presentation in Halle.
Fed with a bunch of flowers & plate, Coric with that big trophy.
The sight is unreal!

I can't believe it happened.

gallery play wrote:
I also think he lacks subtility and finesse. It's not a player with great variety,  nor is he aesthetically pleasing to the eye. His shot selection is quite edgy too.

But...he is one of the very very few players out there who can hit through the RR's and that's good enough for me.

ok then!

Though it's more that RRs finally run themselves into ground...
Maybe today's match is the beginning of that trend.

So far, Delpo was always more dangerous for Nole than Cilic. He just has that FH that wreak havoc through Nole's defence.
I am more uncomfortable when Cilic plays Fed these days...

But I agree that Cilic is the future, strong and steady on both wings...didn't know they were only a week apart...like Nole and Murray.

Delpo stays behind in the old era...which I will miss for real weapons.

It's all Nadal's fault.

The king of spin and sweat really killed tennis.

I wonder what it would have been like today if he had stayed in that village of his playing football...

Yep, and then Djoko came with his Nadal v2 and ruined tennis for all.

Will be remembered as someone who from holding 4GS to falling to 0, in less then a year.

Jahu wrote:So the 27+ is the age now where tennis players get real and mature.

I have been telling you this for the last 10 years!

gallery play wrote:

Tenez wrote:Has Cilic finally become better than the RRunners? Now that he is 29 he seems able to have the confidence and knowledge to beat those guys.

He was certainly the more clutch player today. 

No one can retrieve his best shots. He just needs to string those together at the right time. Like he did today.

Well yes but that his problem the last 10 years. And I still think he is too emotional. It's palpable. I know that next time he will find himself in very intense situation he is more likely to collapse than most.

But again, if he proves me wrong fair enough. But last time he had a poor Federer, he did not make the most of it.

summerblues wrote:

gallery play wrote:Glad you notice because Marin's without a doubt the most underrated player on OTF

Oh, not with me.  I said last year that when Delpo and Cilic had first come out, I thought they were kind of similar but Cilic the better of the two (even though for a long time it did not pan out that way).  And I remember somebody (maybe even you?) agreeing with me.

https://www.atpworldtour.com/en/players/fedex-head-2-head/juan-martin-del-potro-vs-marin-cilic/d683/c977

And thus in spite of Delpo being injured most of the time.

Cilic impresed me only once....and that was when he beat Federer at the USO....but I am pretty sure that Fed made hi look better than he was.