Time Violation Penalty Changes

noleisthebest wrote:I would like to know who complained apart from Murray.

One of them was surely Berdych. He was pretty upset by enforcing of that rule.

I do not know how that will work on courts in reality. Let us imagine that players will have to think about a penalty point after they got a warning. Serving under stress, that is not a good idea. Only alarms could be a partial help. Really tricky decision.

paulcz wrote:

noleisthebest wrote:I would like to know who complained apart from Murray.

One of them was surely Berdych. He was pretty upset by enforcing of that rule.

I do not know how that will work on courts in reality. Let us imagine that players will have to think about a penalty point after they got a warning. Serving under stress, that is not a good idea. Only alarms could be a partial help. Really tricky decision.

How do you know? Did he say anything to the media?

We know Berdych....and I guess Delpo?

noleisthebest wrote:

paulcz wrote:

noleisthebest wrote:I would like to know who complained apart from Murray.

One of them was surely Berdych. He was pretty upset by enforcing of that rule.

I do not know how that will work on courts in reality. Let us imagine that players will have to think about a penalty point after they got a warning. Serving under stress, that is not a good idea. Only alarms could be a partial help. Really tricky decision.

How do you know? Did he say anything to the media?

Paled Berdych literally said in Melbourne "All sports develop but tennis become stunted" and "They (ATP) have become insane, this rule is pure nonsense". Berdych already got a penal point a couple of times. It does not look good with Berdych to play in such a heat.

Tenez wrote:We know Berdych....and I guess Delpo?

I also thought about Delpo. Can you imagine how Morybundus will cope with this rule at French open?

I expect protests from Tony before Morybundus starts to play. That will be next comedy from them.

paulcz wrote: Paled Berdych literally said in Melbourne "All sports develop but tennis become stunted" and "They (ATP) have become insane, this rule is pure nonsense". Berdych already got a penal point a couple of times. It does not look good with Berdych to play in such a heat.

That's very disappointing from Berd. Although he looks good with current weight, tennis-wise, he'd benefit from losing a bit of it, would make his life a lot easier.

It is crucial at this stage that top players esp Federer and Djokovic support the rule and quash the rebellion. I know Federer will, and hope Nole as a number one will stand by him.
Again, great that Nadal is out of action. By the time he comes back (IF he comes back) it will be all running smooth as clockwork.

noleisthebest wrote:

paulcz wrote: Paled Berdych literally said in Melbourne "All sports develop but tennis become stunted" and "They (ATP) have become insane, this rule is pure nonsense". Berdych already got a penal point a couple of times. It does not look good with Berdych to play in such a heat.

That's very disappointing from Berd. Although he looks good with current weight, tennis-wise, he'd benefit from losing a bit of it, would make his life a lot easier.

It is crucial at this stage that top players esp Federer and Djokovic support the rule and quash the rebellion. I know Federer will, and hope Nole as a number one will stand by him.
Again, great that Nadal is out of action. By the time he comes back (IF he comes back) it will be all running smooth as clockwork.

A while ago I saw Nole on TV saying that he accepts this rule and has nothing against it

Berdych plays like in his own shell. He does not like any distraction and his concentration can be lost easily.

paulcz wrote: A while ago I saw Nole on TV saying that he accepts this rule and has nothing against it .

I am not surprised.
Nole takes great pride in his tennis and tennis tradition and is a good number one. He always looked up to Fed when he was younger and learnt a lot from him, how to manage his schedule etc.

Imagine Murray and Nadal leading the pack....we'd have 2 year ranking, 30 seconds between the points, 3 months off season...

Tenez wrote:We know Berdych....and I guess Delpo?

Delpo will probably keep a low profile, he's been involved in a few media "scandals" in Argentina during the off-season.
One of them involved a kiss-and-tell story

A bit more on the topic from Australian Open:

"It appears as if chair umpires at the Australian Open will not be calling time violations as strictly as ATP officials have been in recent weeks. ATP tournament rules permit players to take 25 seconds in between points, while the Grand Slam events have a 20-second rule.
Australian Open tournament referee Wayne McEwen told AAP that the tournament will be flexible and that he has instructed chair umpires"to keep it fair, keep it consistent. We don't want players out there being penalized after playing a fantastic point, but then again we don't want players deliberately taking too long and that's what we really look at. We focus on that and tell them to use good common sense, good judgment. ... The players sometimes need a little time to recover, especially in the heat of the day, or in a long match. Last year's final was a classic match, the points were lasting incredibly long. In a case like that, you don't want to be killing it for everyone."

Some players have complained about the ATP's strict enforcement of the rule during the first two weeks of the season. Servers are given warnings and then charged with service faults for every violation after that.

ATP Player Council representative Kevin Anderson said that his group—which represents the players—voted for the change, and the South African thinks that it was good move. ATP players were scheduled to have general meeting in Melbourne on Saturday night where they planned to discuss the issue.

"I'm a huge fan of the rule," Anderson said. "I mean, it's tough. I feel like I'm playing quicker and I'm still adjusting to it, but I think the rule's just for tennis in general, I think it's a very good rule. And just being on the council, I was part of the talks when we decided to put that through last year. We actually went through a few options. We talked about having a sort of clock on the court, and we thought that wasn't the best option. We spoke about the problem just before about umpires being really reluctant to give away a point straight away. That was another option. I can't remember what the vote was, but there are 10 of us, so there was a deciding vote to put that through."

Novak Djokovic, who beat Rafael Nadal in a record-setting, five-hour and 53-minute final at the 2012 Australian Open, says that he will follow the letter of the law.

"I guess Nadal and myself, we're right up there mentioned in that topic as the players who would be always in danger of the time violation because of the time we are taking between the points,” he said. "It is the way it is. I cannot have any complaints when I take more than 20 seconds between the points. If the chair umpire comes to me and said, ‘Listen, you should be a little bit more careful about it.' If I do it again, he gives me warning, I can't complain about it. It's within the rules and I will respect it."

It's easy to see why Nadal left Players' Council last year....shame he had to push his man through into the Board, and stop Ljubicic getting the job.

noleisthebest wrote:

paulcz wrote: A while ago I saw Nole on TV saying that he accepts this rule and has nothing against it .

I am not surprised.
Nole takes great pride in his tennis and tennis tradition and is a good number one. He always looked up to Fed when he was younger and learnt a lot from him, how to manage his schedule etc.

Imagine Murray and Nadal leading the pack....we'd have 2 year ranking, 30 seconds between the points, 3 months off season...

Fed must be an inspiration for every player, maybe with one exception of Morybundus.

Nole has improved his tennis approach a lot and also his court conduct. Now he is excellent sportsman. Otherwise I think that this rule is going through many and long discussions with some changes/adjustments.

Matches with Morybundus and Murray should be given as salutary TV records at special madhouses, where their residents are forced to lose appetite for meals and also in cases when they are prevented from any moving sport activities

paulcz wrote:Matches with Morybundus and Murray should be given as salutary TV records at special madhouses, where their residents are forced to lose appetite for meals and also in cases when they are prevented from any moving sport activities

....and have rooms wallpapered with this kind of photos:

noleisthebest wrote:

paulcz wrote:Matches with Morybundus and Murray should be given as salutary TV records at special madhouses, where their residents are forced to lose appetite for meals and also in cases when they are prevented from any moving sport activities

....and have rooms wallpapered with this kind of photos:

These pictures are excellent and even affected my appetite, I need to take some wine or will not sleep tonight

noleisthebest wrote:A bit more on the topic from Australian Open:

"Australian Open tournament referee Wayne McEwen told AAP that the tournament will be flexible and that he has instructed chair umpires"to keep it fair, keep it consistent.

Read: "Apply it unfairly to unknown players but none of it to the top players. We have 1000s of fans we can't afford to upset, Without them we can close the house!"

Tenez wrote:

noleisthebest wrote:A bit more on the topic from Australian Open:

"Australian Open tournament referee Wayne McEwen told AAP that the tournament will be flexible and that he has instructed chair umpires"to keep it fair, keep it consistent.

Read: "Apply it unfairly to unknown players but none of it to the top players. We have 1000s of fans we can't afford to upset, Without them we can close the house!"

Yes, a circus is closer than before. Imagine, that the similar rules should be taken also in table tennis/badminton/golf.

Morybundus does not start playing soon, unless Tony is not informed about this

Tenez wrote:

noleisthebest wrote:A bit more on the topic from Australian Open:

"Australian Open tournament referee Wayne McEwen told AAP that the tournament will be flexible and that he has instructed chair umpires"to keep it fair, keep it consistent.

Read: "Apply it unfairly to unknown players but none of it to the top players. We have 1000s of fans we can't afford to upset, Without them we can close the house!"

I hope not. I think umpires found it particularly hard to give warning to Nadal in the past and those rare times they did he always moaned.
Murray is an even bigger moaner, he moans about everything line calls, hawk-eye, although he has calmed down a bit.

In a perverse way it's good that he moaned about this rule in public, because it won't have gone down that well with anyone, really.
I have a feeling Lendl will tell him to ignore it and just use it as it suits him. So, it will all be down to the individual umpire on the day.
Some of them appear to be quite keen. The key match will be the semi-final against Federer.

paulcz wrote:

Tenez wrote:We know Berdych....and I guess Delpo?

I also thought about Delpo. Can you imagine how Morybundus will cope with this rule at French open?

I expect protests from Tony before Morybundus starts to play. That will be next comedy from them.

You bet! What frustrates me is that they have no shame saying they need to cheat to win. Cause at teh end of the day whatever the rules we will have a winner and 127 losers. Applying woudl simply, at worst, provide a different winner.

So in short it's like Bolt saying we need to shorten the marathon to 100m so he can win the marathon as well. Absurd!

Cause at teh end of the day whatever the rules we will have a winner and
127 losers. Applying woudl simply, at worst, provide a different
winner.

Good point. Yesterday it showed some affected result when in the Sydney Final Kevin Anderson who takes long time between points (who was also given a penalty in his semis ) was at times looked like rushing just to avoid getting another penalty. AT the changeover at 3*-4 he had to change his shoes and socks and that took long enough and before that umpire called "time". The commentator were talking about this rush and how can this affect Kevin's play in such and important 8th game of the deciding set. Kevin didn't even get time to regroup himself. And that's what exactly happened. He got broken and Tomic served out the match.

Professional tennis players not so long ago trained their routine to keep it within the 25s and before Nadal everybody accepted and understood the importance of that rule. If I remember correctly the rule is explained in the official rule book as "being a physical sport" therefore another criteria to separate the fit from the less fit (or obviously the risk takers v the retrievers). The 1m30 rest every two games is there to allow players to recover their breath...not between points.

The public never quite "consciously" noticed when Nadal and others started to take extra time. It's only afterwards that we realised that the matches started to be ridiculously long. I have always said that Nadal would have never been able to win* all those long matches he had within the (20s) rule, especially as they were mighty close most of the time.

*edited

he was a big fan of the rule as well!