ATP 500: Beijing, Tokyo

Dolgo wins the first set against Delpo!
Go Dolgo 

Looking at the live scores, Isner managed to squander the 30:15  5:4 serving for the set scenario and lose it.
On serve in the 2nd.
I still think he has better chances against Nadal then Berd. Isner does not do choking.
And Berd breaks him....

Just checked their H2H - 15:3 the 3 wins all came in 2006 for Berdych.
Though, with Nadal struggling with motivation...you never know !

Dolgo Delpo playing an excellent match, anyone watching?

Delpo's just levelled it to one set all.

What a beast he is!

Dolgo playing really well & Delpo's FH's on fire, what a treat! 

Dolgo's serve...sheer magic 

T, some very fast tennis being played atm.

And Delpo wins in the end, the best I've seen him this year, very fast, he'll be a handful for the rest of the season.
Dolgo 

Richie bags the 1st set against Ferrer  
I reckon Ferrer will be out of top 10 next year. About time!

A set and a break up for REEECHAARD!
He now has belief against ferrer after that 5 setter in New york. About time!

NITB is right about Ferrer, he has lost his touch.

Oh no he doesn't LS, Nadal has more FH winners than his opponent for the majority of his matches.
Only when he is playing badly this isnt' the case.

US Open 2013 (in preview to final):
FH Winners- Nadal 113-73 Djokovic
That's a difference of 40, absolutely massive.

There is also more to a forehand than winners anyway... it's what you can do with the shot that counts.
Nadal probably also wins more forced errors than anyone else with the shot... still wins him the point.

Ahh i see you are still browsing v2.

Oh great! One tournament where he was much more aggressive.
But throughout his career, he generally doesn't.
I remember one time you said nadal hit more winners the madrid '11 semi match vs feds. This was completely false and other times when you said he hit more winners than feds, that too was wrong.
Nadal's fh is not as good offensively as feds.

Yes I was wrong that time.
Urgh that's the last time I trusted tennis wetpoint lol

It's not the first time it made me look silly, I remember once in a Del Potro Berdych argument on the old 606 I used tennis wetpoint to research H2H on different surfaces (which isn't given as clearly on ATP), and I was proved wrong as well there later.

In the majority of matches Nadal plays, he will hit considerably more FH winners than his opponent.
It's also worth keeping in mind that even look at just the winners overall will be incorrect, as Nadal hits a very high percentage of winners on his FH compared to others.

Federer will hit more FH winners no doubt, but on the other hand he will also make more unforced errors with the shot.

As for USO 2013, he hit more FH winners than anyone else I think... and he didn't play that differently to how he normally does.

Overall for me I agree with the judgement of v2, Nadal's FH is simply more effective.

I'm supporting Berdych tomorrow for the semi,


first time in a long time I am not supporting Nadal in a match he's playing.

Nadal's FH winners are worthless. He needs 5 moonball shots to set one up, so they are all safe and nothing  to do with proper shotmaking.
Now and then he flukes them on the run, I don't count those as winners either.

Not to mention how far behind the baseline he stands.

Come back and talk about Nadal and his winners when he starts hitting them with open shoulders, standing either on the baseline or inside the court, and hitting them from the word go.
Ideally as flat as possible.

noleisthebest wrote:Nadal's FH winners are worthless.

Awww, how sweet.

He needs 5 moonball shots to set one up, so they are all safe and nothing  to do with proper shotmaking.

How can anyone set up a winner with a moonball? Surely to set up a winner you need to play a good shot, which gives you a chance to hit a winner.
As for safe, I normally don't count these things, but I remember counting this in the French Open Semi Final 5th set vs Djokovic: Nadal hit nearly double the winners as Djokovic and out of those hit the line (baseline) 3 times more than Djokovic.

Now and then he flukes them on the run, I don't count those as winners either.

LOL. Who cares whether you count them?
And considering the high success rate he has with them, it's almost moronic to call them flukes.

Not to mention how far behind the baseline he stands.

Not when he's hitting winners. He normally hits winners when he's on or inside baseline (the only exception being when he is on the run).

Julia Santamaria wrote:In the majority of matches Nadal plays, he will hit considerably more FH winners than his opponent.
It's also worth keeping in mind that even look at just the winners overall will be incorrect, as Nadal hits a very high percentage of winners on his FH compared to others.

Federer will hit more FH winners no doubt, but on the other hand he will also make more unforced errors with the shot.

As for USO 2013, he hit more FH winners than anyone else I think... and he didn't play that differently to how he normally does.

Overall for me I agree with the judgement of v2, Nadal's FH is simply more effective.

That was the most aggressive i've seen him play and the closest to the baseline ive ever seen him play.

Some good matches on tomorrow in Beijing, both ATP and WTA:
Starting at 5.30 AM UK time:

Tomas BERDYCH (CZE) - Rafael NADAL (ESP) [2]
Petra KVITOVA (CZE) [9] - Jelena JANKOVIC (SRB) [
Serena WILLIAMS (USA) [1] - Agnieszka RADWANSKA (POL) [3] (will be cheering for Aga this time)
Not Before 1:30 PM 
Novak DJOKOVIC (SRB) [1] - Richard GASQUET (FRA) [5]

In Tokyo:

Milos RAONIC (CAN) [3] -Ivan DODIG (CRO)
Juan Martin DEL POTRO (ARG) [1] - Nicolas ALMAGRO (ESP) [6]

luvsports! wrote:

Julia Santamaria wrote:In the majority of matches Nadal plays, he will hit considerably more FH winners than his opponent.
It's also worth keeping in mind that even look at just the winners overall will be incorrect, as Nadal hits a very high percentage of winners on his FH compared to others.

Federer will hit more FH winners no doubt, but on the other hand he will also make more unforced errors with the shot.

As for USO 2013, he hit more FH winners than anyone else I think... and he didn't play that differently to how he normally does.

Overall for me I agree with the judgement of v2, Nadal's FH is simply more effective.

That was the most aggressive i've seen him play and the closest to the baseline ive ever seen him play.

True, but it's not that significantly different to his normal style. Marginally so, yes.

noleisthebest wrote:Dolgo's serve...sheer magic 

T, some very fast tennis being played atm.

Shoot did not watch after the fog/Nada match.

Julia Santamaria wrote:Oh no he doesn't LS, Nadal has more FH winners than his opponent for the majority of his matches.
Only when he is playing badly this isnt' the case.

Actually that's not true. Nadal winners start to flow only when his opponents get too tired to run. And Nadal has probably the worst FH winners/FH shots ratio in the history of tennis. ....so that simply disqualify him straight away.

A good FH is a FH that kills the point.

Tenez wrote:

Julia Santamaria wrote:Oh no he doesn't LS, Nadal has more FH winners than his opponent for the majority of his matches.
Only when he is playing badly this isnt' the case.

Actually that's not true.

It is.
In USO 2013 he hit the most FH winners out of anybody. In USO 2010 he had more FH winners in every match compared to his opponent, apart from Verdasco (a bit strange I know- why Fiasco).

Tenez wrote:
A good FH is a FH that kills the point.

Correction:
*A good forehand is one that wins the point.

I can't believe Berdych retired, pathetic!

noleisthebest wrote:I can't believe Berdych retired! :

The result wouldn't have been any different even if he hadn't. Berdych lacks variety and has too may jitters playing Nadal who can retrieve so many balls. 

Nadal now will get to #1 on Monday. He is almost certainly going to finish YE #1 too. He has nothing to defend, all to gain. In fact he looks like keeping it even till RG 2014 or maybe even wimbledon 2014.

Don't know, their last match was pretty close....but the horrible scenario was inevitable, nonetheless...

Well done ITF and WADA  for catching Cilic doping

Delpo wins in 2 TBs. The match had many jaw-dropping points. Nico couldn't keep as much composure as Delpo and lost.

So its Raonic vs Delpo in Tokyo final. Who are you goig with nitb?

Delpo, of course.
I watched him play Dolgopolov yesterday, he was really good, shame it wasn't the final.

Wow, when Petra gets hold of a ball.....run for cover!
Would be great to watch her play her best tennis against Serena, although I initially wanted to see a Jankovic Radwanska final, just as a respite from all this crazy power tennis....
Still, great, courageous ballstriking  from her, looks like Radek has had positive influence

...only to narrowly escape a bagel in the 2nd set!
Funny how she needs a set like that to flush the pressure out during her matches.
Jelena is a tough cookie though, so the 3rd set should be good!

Petra does not manage to recever her composure this time but not too worried about it!
Now, can Aga knock Serena out THAT is the question!

Shanghai draw is out
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Shanghai_Rolex_Masters_%E2%80%93_Singles

feds in djoko's quarter, ferrer in tsonga's, delpo in berdych's and stan the man in rafa's.

Big early matches could come from raonic vs wawrinka and gasquet vs feds in the 3rd round.

luvsports! wrote:Shanghai draw is out
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Shanghai_Rolex_Masters_%E2%80%93_Singles

feds in djoko's quarter, ferrer in tsonga's, delpo in berdych's and stan the man in rafa's.

Big early matches could come from raonic vs wawrinka and gasquet vs feds in the 3rd round.

Nooooooooooooo.    

Richie 3:1 up and serving  
Come on Nole, Nadal is waiting 

After seeing the close-up of his face, he actually looks pale and unwell. Strange.

He,he, by the time I went and made the coffee it's 3 all, Nole felt my spirited long-distance support 

Djokovic is serving so well it's scary.

He looks unbeatable, fitting that he's brought his best tennis of the year to ATP Beijing500.

Please stop.

Nole talking to himself a lot and is very frustrated, more than usual. In the berating, masochistic mood big time.
He is also playing a bit more aggressively than recently, so maybe that's how he's dealing with that extra adrenaline kicking about.

But very good to see him look more like his 2011 self, not the subdued, sedated 2013 version he has been all year.

He's playing superbly, best I've seen this year.
Always knows when to up his game does Nole.

It's interesting to watch Gasquet when he plays freely, very similar to Stan but more variety in the BH.
Yet, he chooses to shy away from the baseline. Such a shame.

What do you do to make him more confident, he has every reason to be!

His forehand is a pretty poor shot, and I'd say Stan's BH is marginally better than Gasquet's.

Anyway, what can anyone do when up against an opponent playing like this?

Another easy win coming up for nole over gasquet.

Obviously JS didn't see nole in aus, dubai or monte carlo.

OK, so we have the finals out for tomorrow:

In Beijing, 9.00 UK time:
Djokovic-Nadal (GO NOLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE          )

&

In Tokyo, 6 AM UK time:
Del Potro-Raonic

luvsports! wrote:Obviously JS didn't see nole in aus, dubai or monte carlo.

He didn't play that great in Australia, not until the last 2 matches anyway. Nearly went out to Stan. In Dubai he didn't really face anyone who was at his level, in Monte Carlo he started off really badly but then was immense at the end.
Beijing is the first tournament where he's played at such a high level right from R1 to the last match.

Julia Santamaria wrote:

luvsports! wrote:Obviously JS didn't see nole in aus, dubai or monte carlo.

He didn't play that great in Australia, not until the last 2 matches anyway. Nearly went out to Stan. In Dubai he didn't really face anyone who was at his level, in Monte Carlo he started off really badly but then was immense at the end.
Beijing is the first tournament where he's played at such a high level right from R1 to the last match.

Unlike Nadal who didn't have the guts to show his face in Australia...but chose to cower around Mickey Mouse 250 tournaments in Latin America, until Larry Ellison poured a ton of sand into the blue paint to convince those precious "injured" knees they would be fine....

What  a charade....amazing how the softest and kindest of all surfaces - Wimbledon grass seems to be causing Nadal all the problems and injuries!

Well why don't you say that then?

noleisthebest wrote:Unlike Nadal who didn't have the guts to show his face in Australia

As a Djokovic fan you should be so happy that Nadal couldn't play there, count your lucky stars- Nadal would have destroyed Djokovic.