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World Tour Final - London 2019

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Post by Jahu Wed Nov 06, 2019 12:26 pm

Group Agassi:

- Nadal
- Medevedev
- Tsitsipas
- Zverev


Group Borg:

- Fed
- Djoko
- Thiem
- Berrettini


Sunday order of play:

2pm - Djoko - Berrettini
8pm - Fed - Thiem


Monday order of play:

2pm - Medvedev - Tsitsipas
8pm - Nadal - Zerev



Come on ROGER !!!!!

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Post by summerblues Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:29 am

Jahu wrote:Come on ROGER !!!!!
+1

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Post by summerblues Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:30 am

Group Agassi.  Group Borg.  When did they start with this silly naming of the groups?

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Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark Thu Nov 07, 2019 9:04 am

summerblues wrote:Group Agassi.  Group Borg.  When did they start with this silly naming of the groups?

I remember it was like this last year too but different ones.

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Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark Thu Nov 07, 2019 9:05 am

Nadal is likely to quit before the 1st match or latest by the end of 2nd RR match.

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Post by summerblues Sat Nov 09, 2019 2:14 pm

raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:Nadal is likely to quit before the 1st match or latest by the end of 2nd RR match.
You think so?  My guess is he will try to claim YE #1, which should not be too physically draining.  So I expect he will give it a good go, at least initially.

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Post by Daniel2 Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:04 am

As soon as he looks to be losing the limp will suddenly start and the fake grimaces.  Been doing it over a decade.
Also, if Djok doesn't win tournament, isn't he YE N1 anyway?

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Post by Tenez Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:15 pm

I cannot see Djokovic equalling/overtaking Fed's slam # yet....whereas Nadal is eerily close.




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Post by Daniel2 Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:41 pm

Djok hasn't got a chance and never did.  Nadal does but only because of surfaces being too similar and the French Open with no opposition.

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Post by N2D2L Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:57 pm

Lol who exactly in this weak era had a chance against Djokovic in a slam?

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Post by N2D2L Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:57 pm

Thiem played well today but Federer was off the pace.

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Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:46 am

Fed was off, but Thiem plays well against Fed since the beginning. So wasn't very surprised at the result.

So likely Fed is not going to qualify for the SF.

Anyone expecting a last sec withdrawal from Nadal?

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Post by N2D2L Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:07 am

I watched Nadals training session online yesterday, his serve has gradually improved over the last few days, and I reckon he will play.

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Post by N2D2L Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:16 pm

Nadal totally out of sorts, hopefully with some more practice this week he settles in better. Otherwise he may as well go home and relax.

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Post by summerblues Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:19 am

After the first round:

Big Three 1 - 2 Youngsters

Change of guard, finally?

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Post by luvsports! Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:36 pm

Best I've seen Thiem play on hard court. Great match.

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Post by luvsports! Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:58 pm

What a set! 1-1!

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Post by Tenez Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:59 pm

Agree. What a point in that last game of 2nd set.

Those guys don;t play 5m behind the baseline but Thiem hits as hard.

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Post by luvsports! Tue Nov 12, 2019 10:18 pm

This is the biggest I have seen Thiem hit the ball. He's hitting nearly 10mph faster on both wings than Novak.

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Post by Tenez Tue Nov 12, 2019 10:26 pm

luvsports! wrote:This is the biggest I have seen Thiem hit the ball. He's hitting nearly 10mph faster on both wings than Novak.

Does that mean much?

His BH certainly is extremely impressive considering that for once I see Thiem stick to the baseline.....thing he was not doing in the past.

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Post by luvsports! Tue Nov 12, 2019 10:29 pm

Well, yes.
I've never seen him hit this big and never have I seen him outpower Novak this much.
But, Novak will still win.

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Post by Tenez Tue Nov 12, 2019 10:47 pm

A very nervous Djokovic at a crucial game again.

He is a poor front runner but very dangerous when he has nothing to lose. Very tenacious....like the plague.

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Post by luvsports! Tue Nov 12, 2019 10:51 pm

Poor game.
Broken.
Tiebreak.

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Post by luvsports! Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:01 pm

HE DID IT!

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Post by Tenez Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:02 pm

luvsports! wrote:...But, Novak will still win.

Nice Jinx....Amri will be impressed.

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Post by luvsports! Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:03 pm

Haha. I honestly thought it though!

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Post by N2D2L Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:47 pm

Tenez wrote:
luvsports! wrote:...But, Novak will still win.

Nice Jinx....Amri will be impressed.

Can confirmed I am indeed impressed by LS’ work this evening.

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Post by N2D2L Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:48 pm

Djokovic Thiem matches these days are starting to resemble the Nole Stan slam matches of old... thiem in control.

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Post by summerblues Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:33 am

Did not see the match, but well done to Thiem.  I now looked at 3rd set TB.  Good for Thiem not collapsing at 0:3.  He must have felt miserable having failed to serve out the match and being down two min-breaks.  But he did not show it.

Federer vs Nole for a spot in SF.

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Post by Tenez Wed Nov 13, 2019 7:51 am

BEL19VE wrote:Djokovic Thiem matches these days are starting to resemble the Nole Stan slam matches of old... thiem in control.

Agree. But what is strange is how Djokovic tenses up in spite of his record.

Even though he has the best record of matches won from MP down, he is probably by far the weakest player mentally of the top trio. He had the tennis, the fitness rather, to surpass them all but his career is plagued with poor mental collapses.

I'll make a list of it.

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Post by Jahu Wed Nov 13, 2019 12:13 pm

Thats why no on likes Djoko, even with his shit slow no attack all defense game, he manages to be on top of tennis rankings, and last night he only won 2 points less that Thiem. He is getting slower and losing now.

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Post by Slippy Wed Nov 13, 2019 12:42 pm

Tenez wrote:
BEL19VE wrote:Djokovic Thiem matches these days are starting to resemble the Nole Stan slam matches of old... thiem in control.

Agree. But what is strange is how Djokovic tenses up in spite of his record.

Even though he has the best record of matches won from MP down, he is probably by far the weakest player mentally of the top trio. He had the tennis, the fitness rather, to surpass them all but his career is plagued with poor mental collapses.

I'll make a list of it.
I’m sure there are some but I literally can’t think of a single match where I would say Novak has choked. His mental strength is one of his greatest attributes. He’s a superb front runner and, as you say, also has a phenomenal record of recovery. 

All the top 3 are exceptionally strong mentally but if I was to list them it would be Novak, Nadal and then Fed last - we only need to look back at the Wimbledon final to see the slight edge Novak has over Fed mentally.

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Post by Slippy Wed Nov 13, 2019 12:44 pm

Great wins for Thiem and leaves Novak v Fed as a real blockbuster. Superb for the tournament. 

Expect Medvedev to see off Nadal today and picking Zverev to beat Tsitsipas.

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Post by N2D2L Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:00 pm

Tenez wrote: He had the tennis, the fitness rather, to surpass them all but his career is plagued with poor mental collapses.

I'll make a list of it.

Haha please do, it will cheer me up after Nadals sad display on Sunday

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Post by Tenez Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:00 pm

Another player with a great BH....Medvedev! not stylish but nonetheless deadly.

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Post by Tenez Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:38 pm

It's great to see Nadal play within the rule. No time wasting in this tournament. I knew he could...like I knew he could not win without it.

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Post by Tenez Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:41 pm

wow....Mevedev losing it v Nadal like Medvedev lost it versus Agassi in that FO final!

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Post by luvsports! Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:55 pm

5-1 up, now in a tiebreak. Medvedev has ducked this...

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Post by N2D2L Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:00 pm

Hahaha

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Post by luvsports! Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:02 pm

Lol.

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Post by N2D2L Thu Nov 14, 2019 3:58 am


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Post by summerblues Thu Nov 14, 2019 4:15 am

LOL.  Here I am hoping that Medvedev can step up and take over as a multislam winner and No 1 next year to prevent Rafa and Nole from advancing further and instead he turns out to be a choker par excellence.

Not what we needed Sad

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Post by summerblues Thu Nov 14, 2019 4:19 am

Slippy wrote:I’m sure there are some but I literally can’t think of a single match where I would say Novak has choked. His mental strength is one of his greatest attributes. He’s a superb front runner and, as you say, also has a phenomenal record of recovery. 

All the top 3 are exceptionally strong mentally but if I was to list them it would be Novak, Nadal and then Fed last - we only need to look back at the Wimbledon final to see the slight edge Novak has over Fed mentally.
I tend to agree with the ordering but for an example of a brutal Nole choke I would go to RG 2013.  That was pretty bad - not just the point itself but also how meekly he collapsed thereafter - Federeresque even.

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Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark Thu Nov 14, 2019 9:15 am

summerblues wrote:LOL.  Here I am hoping that Medvedev can step up and take over as a multislam winner and No 1 next year to prevent Rafa and Nole from advancing further and instead he turns out to be a choker par excellence.

Not what we needed Sad

He will do well, just dropped guard at the worst possible time i.e. serving out the match. Then Nadal took the momentum and Med couldn't recover mentally.

If he can learn from this match, it was not too bad. He played excellent till 5-2 serving for the set.

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Post by Tenez Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:36 pm

Slippy wrote:
Tenez wrote:
BEL19VE wrote:Djokovic Thiem matches these days are starting to resemble the Nole Stan slam matches of old... thiem in control.

Agree. But what is strange is how Djokovic tenses up in spite of his record.

Even though he has the best record of matches won from MP down, he is probably by far the weakest player mentally of the top trio. He had the tennis, the fitness rather, to surpass them all but his career is plagued with poor mental collapses.

I'll make a list of it.
I’m sure there are some but I literally can’t think of a single match where I would say Novak has choked. His mental strength is one of his greatest attributes. He’s a superb front runner and, as you say, also has a phenomenal record of recovery. 

All the top 3 are exceptionally strong mentally but if I was to list them it would be Novak, Nadal and then Fed last - we only need to look back at the Wimbledon final to see the slight edge Novak has over Fed mentally.

First do you understand that the mental strengh required to run after a ball and bringing it back is not the same as pulling a winner time and time again at crucial times?
The former requires to be tenacious and have a good pair of legs and big arms providing good margins helps whereas the latter require pure mental strength and incomparable talent .

In that respect Federer is miles ahead of Nadal and Djokovic.

The best example I can give you is that USO 2011 Djokovic won. It really sums up the difference in mental strengh and explains the why the outcome is almost always in favour of the defending player.

In this match, every time the point matters , Djoko makes a nervous mistake, a double fault on break point, letting Federer leading every until Fed gets to 2 match points. Honestly have a look at it and watch Djoko collapse every time. It is only when he has nothing to lose that he plays a bit more freely.

And it is also what happened in this year Wimbledon final.

There is nothing mentally strong is depending on his opponent to pull an ace or not.

Djoko has saved tons of matches from MP down but that says more about his fitness that his mental strength I am afraid.

There is no player that shows more nervousness through his shots than Djoko. His shots become so soft and rallies tend to last ages on crucial points.

he is anything but a gutsy player....except maybe against nadal or when he is 2 sets and 2 breaks up.

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Post by Tenez Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:43 pm

And frankly, do you really think Djoko and Nadal would have had that many slams had Federer played with their tool (larger frame) from childhood?
Like do you really think the match this year at Wimbledon would have been that close Had Djoko been 38 and fed 32? please compare apples with apples.

Fed is in a totally different league in every department. But as we know you never liked him so it is going to be difficult for you to be objective.

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Post by N2D2L Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:53 pm

Hypotheticals and speculation are all well and good, but at the end of the day if Djokovic ends up on most Slams which I think he will, he'll be regarded the greatest by most media and neutral tennis fans.

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Post by Tenez Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:00 pm

BEL19VE wrote:Hypotheticals and speculation are all well and good, but at the end of the day if Djokovic ends up on most Slams which I think he will, he'll be regarded the greatest by most media and neutral tennis fans.
That is a way to avoid the truth and debate. The fact remains that since Fed adopting his racquet he has not lost to Nadal..under playable conds in spite of getting really old. .

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Post by Tenez Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:02 pm

4 more slams is another 25% of what he has. Besides winning at the AO.....he was not convincing since then....that's nearly a year ago and it is not going to be any easier from now.

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Post by N2D2L Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:13 pm

Nadal's as a baseliner depends more on speed though, which is something he's lost since 2014. It's hard to tell what would have happened if you had a prime Nadal who could chase everything down vs Fed with his new racket.
I mean I still think Federer was better in 2005-9 compared to 2017-2018, racket aside, as was Nadal.

Anyway I don't think your main concern is Nadal anyway, he is done winning slams imo. It's Djokovic who should worry you.

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