Nadal out for another 2 months

Im not even talking about the controversial doping subject Tenez,I think the sport is better off without all the other crap from Nadal,the constant on court coaching,abusing medical time outs,faking injuries,breaking the rules of the game,the way he tries to bully and intimidate his opponents and all the other poor sportsmanship we see in almost every match that Nadal plays in
I agree that Nadal has been brilliant rival for Federer and actually proves how great Roger truly is,but I still think the sport is better off now without him.Federer has achieved the greatest thing he possibly could by coming back to being world no1 at 31 years old,theres really no need for Nadal anymore.He had his uses before and now he has none

I'm with you on this one veejay

The longer he;s gone the more I can forget about him.

Veejay wrote:
I agree that Nadal has been brilliant rival for Federer and actually proves how great Roger truly is

Yeah...

8-2 in Slams, 8-2

If Nadal was to end his career tomorrow, there would be a lot of records that go with him. 1 defeat at RG!! No-one in the Open Era can boast of such a record. His H2H's with other players. I would like to see Federer at least beat him at RG.

No LK, nothing proves greatness than being thrashed by your main rival in major events

Nadals main function is, apparently, to prove Rogers greatness

legendkillar wrote:If Nadal was to end his career tomorrow, there would be a lot of records that go with him. 1 defeat at RG!! No-one in the Open Era can boast of such a record. His H2H's with other players. I would like to see Federer at least beat him at RG.

Nadal has some fantastic records, I think one of the best W/L records in the open era, as well as many more.
He has cemented his legacy as one of the greats of the game, and the greatest clay courter in history.
To suggest his only function is to prove Roger's greatness is frankly laughable, although not surprising from someone like Veejay (who also writes thread like these http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/158241).

Amritia3ee wrote:

Veejay wrote:
I agree that Nadal has been brilliant rival for Federer and actually proves how great Roger truly is

Yeah...

8-2 in Slams, 8-2

Laugh now Amritia,we will see who has the last laugh the day Nadal has to forfeit all his titles like LA
Considering the suspicion about drug abuse campaign thats developed against el toro in recent months,I would say that day isnt that far away

mikeyM1000 wrote:I'm with you on this one veejay

The longer he;s gone the more I can forget about him.

He still somehow manages to steal the headlines with all the lies about his so called injury,but I agree,the longer he is gone the more forgettable he becomes

Veejay wrote:

Amritia3ee wrote:

Veejay wrote:
I agree that Nadal has been brilliant rival for Federer and actually proves how great Roger truly is

Yeah...

8-2 in Slams, 8-2

Laugh now Amritia,we will see who has the last laugh the day Nadal has to forfeit all his titles like LA
Considering the suspicion about drug abuse campaign thats developed against el toro in recent months,I would say that day isnt that far away

If we are expecting a USDA style bust I think we will be dead in our graves before they bust one of their own!

Veejay wrote:

Amritia3ee wrote:

Veejay wrote:
I agree that Nadal has been brilliant rival for Federer and actually proves how great Roger truly is

Yeah...

8-2 in Slams, 8-2

Laugh now Amritia,we will see who has the last laugh the day Nadal has to forfeit all his titles like LA
Considering the suspicion about drug abuse campaign thats developed against el toro in recent months,I would say that day isnt that far away

Dream on Veejay, dream on

Veejay why would you take pleasure in that if it happened to be true? I am sick of the scandal and disgrace. Haven't you admitted to substance abuse yourself? Even if Nadal did cheat would it make you happy to see the man destroyed, I don't think you are that vengeful of a person are you? All that does is hurt Nadal, his family, his friends, and the game of tennis itself.

Dream on Veejay, dream on

I dont need to dream Amritia,for a very long time it looked like LA would never be exposed,who would have thought it could ever implode so fantastically?
Seriously...what are you gonna do when it happens?
I would be very worried if I were you cause once Nadal stops being a cash cow,there will be no reason to protect him anymore
The truth always has a way of coming out

To me I find the cycle of deceit, inneundo, witch hunt, and scandal to be ruining sports in general. Anybody who doesn't look at the real world around them and acknowledge that we have already lost the war on drugs and our best bet is to see if we can get favorable surrender terms and sue for peace, so as to stop self inflicting further wounds on ourselves is being lets say idealistic.

socal1976 wrote:Veejay why would you take pleasure in that if it happened to be true? I am sick of the scandal and disgrace. Haven't you admitted to substance abuse yourself? Even if Nadal did cheat would it make you happy to see the man destroyed, I don't think you are that vengeful of a person are you? All that does is hurt Nadal, his family, his friends, and the game of tennis itself.

Yes I have admitted to sing PED's,but I am not professional athlete,I am not cheating my way to winning anything
Im not involved in competition,nor is what I did wrong because the substances arent banned for personal use,if I get caught with anything,nothing is going to happen
What about all the people Nadal hurts? Do they not deserve fair play?
Why should I give an ounce of sympathy to someone who knowingly tries to cheat and seek out an unfair advantage at every given opportunity,and then not give a toss about everyone it affects or hurts in the process?
Sorry Socal,Im not like you,the guilty party loses all rights in my opinion.Nadal has made his bed,he must lie in it.If he decides to cheat by getting coached from the stands,to bully opponents by bumping into them on purpose and continues with all his other poor sportsmanship then he deserves he gets,he is only reaping what he sowed
I am all for a player like him being made an example of,he doesnt deserve my sympathy whatsoever and tennis doesnt deserve what he is doing to it either

Take it away from Nadal because it is clear you have a bias when it comes to one guy. Look at the big picture, society is holding these players to a standard which society itself does not follow. Furthermore, is PED use a worse crime than crippling someone through negligence, or criminal rape and robbery Veejay? As a lawyer the notion that we have these guys blood and till their 90 years old we are going to continually test said blood with ever more increasing technology with no thought to a proper statute of limitations is ridiculous. Should an 80 year old champion be destroyed as an old man because at 19 he made a mistake? The point I am making is under our legal system even the worst of crimes has a time limit for prosecution. Are we going to hound these people till the day the die? You use drugs that are dangerous and so do and so do most people and performance enhancing as well.

Do you know how many people die as a result of complications from elective plastic surgery? Or how many old guys have crocked from the use of boner medication? How many people die from drugs or alcohol? Is it not a bit hypoctritical for us to point the finger at the athlete and say look at you, "you terrible cheating druggie!". Especially, when according to you the problem is rampant in sports and athletes are under intense pressure to compete, maybe they cheat because they know others are and they need to make a living.

Veejay wrote:
The truth always has a way of coming out

Indeed it will

socal1976 wrote:Take it away from Nadal because it is clear you have a bias when it comes to one guy. Look at the big picture, society is holding these players to a standard which society itself does not follow. Furthermore, is PED use a worse crime than crippling someone through negligence, or criminal rape and robbery Veejay? As a lawyer the notion that we have these guys blood and till their 90 years old we are going to continually test said blood with ever more increasing technology with no thought to a proper statute of limitations is ridiculous. Should an 80 year old champion be destroyed as an old man because at 19 he made a mistake? The point I am making is under our legal system even the worst of crimes has a time limit for prosecution. Are we going to hound these people till the day the die? You use drugs that are dangerous and so do and so do most people and performance enhancing as well.

Do you know how many people die as a result of complications from elective plastic surgery? Or how many old guys have crocked from the use of boner medication? How many people die from drugs or alcohol? Is it not a bit hypoctritical for us to point the finger at the athlete and say look at you, "you terrible cheating druggie!". Especially, when according to you the problem is rampant in sports and athletes are under intense pressure to compete, maybe they cheat because they know others are and they need to make a living.

How can you blame me for the opinion I have been forced to develop of Nadal?
I didnt do anything wrong...Im not the one who lies,cheats and tries to gain an unfair advantage at every given opportunity
My opinion of him wasnt just formed after 1 or 2 instances,its been years worth of poor sportsmanship from him and its gotten so bad that we now see it happen in almost every single match
Why are you making excuses for someone breaking the rules of the game? The rules are the rules,everyone has to abide by them,Nadal is no exception-case closed
Do you really not care about sport being fair for all,youre more concerned about being sympathetic to someone who cheats,what about beign sympathetic to those who dont cheat..??? Talk about having your priorities all wrong!!

Of course worse crimes are being done out there,but just because worse crimes are being done doesnt mean we should just turn our back on the rules of sport and allow cheating and drug abuse
All wrongs,whether done in life or in sport should try to be prevented and everyone who does wrong,whether in life or sport should be held accountable for doing wrong
What kind of message do you think we send out to kids if we go by your twisted double standards by saying things like..."dont worry about athletes do wrong in sport,thats ok,we should only concentrate on/and consider raping and murdering wrong"
Shouldnt we be teaching kids that all wrong is wrong,there is no "white wrong"
Cheating is cheating,whether it be in a test at school or in sport,its stealing from those around you and who youre competing against
Your comment is a cock of SHIT,it is a pile of manure..it really is Socal....coming here and making excuses for cheating,bullying and stealing by pointing the finger at elective plastic surgery and alcoholics...I mean really???? Are these your morals Socal?
Last time I checked this was a tennis forum,not AA.If we as tennis fans want to talk about drug abuse and get angry at those who are stealing the sports biggest titles by abusing drugs then this is the place to do it
If you have a problem accepting that then perhaps this isnt the place for you...

Veejay wrote:

How can you blame me for the opinion I have been forced to develop of Nadal?

No one's blaming you Veejay

SR wrote:"@SR... non-believers is a phrase used to denigrate religions."

LF, says who? What’s the basis of this random statement?
Can you clarify what you’re trying to say?

There is a stronger word - infidel - which implies lack of fidelity, loyalty, true faith, etc. It seems to me that there is line being drawn between believers and non-believers, which is an over-simplification. Does that help clarify?

LF, you do realise everything you say is going to get a torrent of abuse.
Unless you hate Nadal that is.

Wow veej, i think you are on a roid rage right now buddy. My persona morality has kept me off of all hard drugs and thankfully unaddicted, and I have never used performance enhancers not in the bedroom or at sports. So please don't make it a question of my morality Veejay. A great many things i find immoral are legal and rightly so it is not for me to sit in judgement of others.

In short i suggest you calm down a bit especially your verbosity, say more in fewer words. I think you are caught up in a hatred of Nadal and incapable of analyzing a matter of policy coolly or logically. Sad that you can not see the forrest from the trees.

@LF "There is no such thing as a 'silent' ban which keeps moving and the player facing this so-called ban can make statements to the press of when he/she is coming back."

"Silent" doesn't refer to the player but the ban/suspension itself, which will not be made public and hence "silent."

You forgot the ] when you opened up the quote.

Alright, good old speech-marks are good to

@Veejay... have you considered the possibility that you might be wrong in your 100% certainty? Apart from the doping-related possibility, when you reference other issues, there are many other players who abuse rules, one specific example being time-between-points. Let the chair umpire be the judge, not the spectators, who may be subjective.

Veejay wrote:How can you blame me for the opinion I have been forced to develop of Nadal?

Can I force you change your opinion? (Do I need to try harder?)

@SR... Jones, Agassi, Johnson, LA, and many more... the list is long. There is an on-going trial now. Let us see what comes out of it. I will be glad to see all the names on those lists be made public, without any exceptions. There is no need to protect a specific player.

In Nadal's specific case, since 2006 (the Dimanche reports) have hinted. His team knows he is under scrutiny. If it takes an LA-like expose, so be it.

@SoCal... the frozen samples with future testing regimens may reveal more. Unlike criminal statute of limitations, since sport has no criminality associated with doping, equating such statutes may be debatable. This is also Raiders's argument.

@Amritia3ee... perhaps there are high emotions involved now, but sane debate is always possible.

Amritia3ee wrote:No one's blaming you Veejay

Socal is calling my opinion bias,I am not the one who is to be blamed for the opinion I have been forced to form of Nadal
I actually feel really insulted that Socal can come here and try to justify cheating to me,that because there are worse things being done out there,that that somehow makes cheating in sport ok or right
Is the guy for real?
I dont know whats more disturbing,the fact that he believes the crap he types or that he is trying to sell it to me

Veejay... have you considered the possibility that you might be wrong in your 100% certainty? Apart from the doping-related possibility, when you reference other issues, there are many other players who abuse rules, one specific example being time-between-points. Let the chair umpire be the judge, not the spectators, who may be subjective.

Did I not say that Im not even talking about the controversial subject about doping and that I am purely basing this on all of Nadals poor sportsmanship?
I am not saying all the players are innocent,they have all done something wrong from time to time,the difference with Nadal is that he does something in almost every single match.His tactics also has a direct impact on the outcome of matches,if you can overlook that,then thats fine for you but you cant expect me to

Can I force you change your opinion? (Do I need to try harder?)

I dont believe that was ever the subject thats being debated.My opinion has been forced to become what it is through years of seeing Nadal trying to gain an unfair advantage at every given opportunity
The only person who can change my opinion would be Nadal,if I see a similar amount of ears worth of good sportsmanship from him in comparison to the years of poor sportsmanship,then I would be more then happy to change my opinion
Until that happens,my hands are tied and my opinion remains the same

8-2.

Veejay

Amritia3ee wrote:You forgot the ] when you opened up the quote.

Gee thanx amri, you know I'm hopeless in such technical things.

Say, how come you insisted that raiders apologise to LF for calling her an old lady but you remain silent about LF apologizing for calling me (indirectly) a "religious fanatic"? Not that I care, but your sense of righteousness doesn't seem very consistent.

Did she call you a religious fanatic?
Sorry, I did not see it.
Can you quote it? (or just use speechmarks lol).

If so, then yes of course LF should apologise.

Veejay wrote:

Amritia3ee wrote:No one's blaming you Veejay

Socal is calling my opinion bias,I am not the one who is to be blamed for the opinion I have been forced to form of Nadal
I actually feel really insulted that Socal can come here and try to justify cheating to me,that because there are worse things being done out there,that that somehow makes cheating in sport ok or right
Is the guy for real?
I dont know whats more disturbing,the fact that he believes the crap he types or that he is trying to sell it to me

No Veejay as usual in your desire to be outraged you fail to grasp my argument at all. I am not saying there are worse crimes out there and therefore we should allow PEDs. What i am saying is that we lost the war on drugs and got our ass kicked a long time ago, maybe we should cut a deal and accept it. Furthermore, as an attorney and staunch supporter of human rights I have a problem with investigating athletes possibly decades after the act in question. Here is why in all actions CIVIL AND CRIMINAL A STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS EXISTS AND FOR GOOD REASON.

As prosecution gets farther away in time from the act in question it becomes more and more difficult for the defendant to access documents, witnesses, and evidence to defend himself. Defending a 50 year old charge is very difficult if all your corroborating witnesses are dead. Secondly, sometimes punishing someone can itself be an injustice. If a tennis champ made a mistake at age 19 and then lived and exemplary life and then all of sudden at 70 we find out oh he tested positive, now we destroy the guys life? To me that isn't equitable either. I think hounding people to their grave for past mistakes distant in times is not smiled upon by our legal system.

Amritia3ee wrote:Alright, good old speech-marks are good to

It's good too, not good to, if you don't mind.

SR wrote:

Amritia3ee wrote:Alright, good old speech-marks are good to

It's good too, not good to, if you don't mind.

Thanks SR, I forgot the second 'o'

Can you quote what you were saying earlier?

socal1976 wrote:Wow veej, i think you are on a roid rage right now buddy. My persona morality has kept me off of all hard drugs and thankfully unaddicted, and I have never used performance enhancers not in the bedroom or at sports. So please don't make it a question of my morality Veejay. A great many things i find immoral are legal and rightly so it is not for me to sit in judgement of others.

In short i suggest you calm down a bit especially your verbosity, say more in fewer words. I think you are caught up in a hatred of Nadal and incapable of analyzing a matter of policy coolly or logically. Sad that you can not see the forrest from the trees.

Once again its you who is being the major hypocrite here,you tell me to look at all the far worse things being done out there,rather then pointing out that an athlete who tried to gain an unfair advantage at every given opportunity,then you try to smear me for having used PED's,in comparison to you who hasnt and want to to talk about moral clarity..
You havent changed one bit from all the crap you write on v2
So let me get this straight,you can question my morality for having used PED's but if a pro athlete uses it,thats fine and I am in the wrong for even mentioning it...why dont you hold a pro athlete to the same standard?
And then on top of that you want to talk to me about seeing the forrest from the trees...
Are you for real?
Forget about the doping,my opinion is based purely on his poor sportsmanship...which consists of cheating,lying and seeking out an unfair advantage at every given opportunity,his tactics have a direct impact on the outcome of matches
If you want to over look that,thats fine for you,but dont expect m to
I am pissed off cause I feel insulted that you could even try to sell such a load of garbage to me,I am the last person you should ever try to justify cheating to..I am warning you now already
An this isnt v2,you cant come here and tell me what to do,I will respond in any manner I feel is necessary

Veejay wrote:
I am pissed off cause I feel insulted that you could even try to sell such a load of garbage to me,I am the last person you should ever try to justify cheating to..I am warning you now already

Veejay

If it makes you feel any better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REuf_2QY6kc

Amritia3ee wrote:Did she call you a religious fanatic?
Sorry, I did not see it.
Can you quote it? (or just use speechmarks lol).

If so, then yes of course LF should apologise.

Nah, not your problem. LIke I said, I don't really care. I'm moving on.

Amritia3ee wrote:

Veejay wrote:
I agree that Nadal has been brilliant rival for Federer and actually proves how great Roger truly is

Yeah...

8-2 in Slams, 8-2

17> 11 (provided he gets to keep the tainted titles)

SR wrote:

Amritia3ee wrote:

Veejay wrote:
I agree that Nadal has been brilliant rival for Federer and actually proves how great Roger truly is

Yeah...

8-2 in Slams, 8-2

17> 11 (provided he gets to keep the tainted titles)

Yes you're right, it does depend on whether Federer gets to keep his tainted titles.

Oh, you were talking about Nadal!
Apologies, didn't realise

Oh no Veejay is threatening to be mean to me. What shall I do? Again you seem to have a reading comprehension problem because your characterization of my position is one hundred percent wrong. So if you want to mischaracterizae and build straw men arguments you really aren't worth much more of my time. And Veejay you may have big steroid infused muscles in real life but you aren't very scary from behind a keyboard.

socal1976 wrote:

Veejay wrote:

Amritia3ee wrote:No one's blaming you Veejay

Socal is calling my opinion bias,I am not the one who is to be blamed for the opinion I have been forced to form of Nadal
I actually feel really insulted that Socal can come here and try to justify cheating to me,that because there are worse things being done out there,that that somehow makes cheating in sport ok or right
Is the guy for real?
I dont know whats more disturbing,the fact that he believes the crap he types or that he is trying to sell it to me

No Veejay as usual in your desire to be outraged you fail to grasp my argument at all. I am not saying there are worse crimes out there and therefore we should allow PEDs. What i am saying is that we lost the war on drugs and got our ass kicked a long time ago, maybe we should cut a deal and accept it. Furthermore, as an attorney and staunch supporter of human rights I have a problem with investigating athletes possibly decades after the act in question. Here is why in all actions CIVIL AND CRIMINAL A STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS EXISTS AND FOR GOOD REASON.



As prosecution gets farther away in time from the act in question it becomes more and more difficult for the defendant to access documents, witnesses, and evidence to defend himself. Defending a 50 year old charge is very difficult if all your corroborating witnesses are dead. Secondly, sometimes punishing someone can itself be an injustice. If a tennis champ made a mistake at age 19 and then lived and exemplary life and then all of sudden at 70 we find out oh he tested positive, now we destroy the guys life? To me that isn't equitable either. I think hounding people to their grave for past mistakes distant in times is not smiled upon by our legal system.

No Socal,you never said anything of the sort...dont piss in my bucket then tell me its raining
As I said in my previous comment,something which both you and Laverfan seem to ignore,I initially said I think the sport is better off without Nadal because of his poor sportsmanship,forget about the doping,focus purely on all his other cheating tactics

You then tried to come here and justify cheating to me which youre even doing with the war on drugs...just because its a losing battle doesnt automatically make it right,or that we should just give up and give in to cheating
Youre forever talking your uranus..how may times did I have to expose your double standard hypocritical crap you type over on v2..and then you claim to be an attorney *shocking!!!*

socal1976 wrote:Oh no Veejay is threatening to be mean to me. What shall I do?

Flee to Basel!

Veejay, is it true what they say about steroids and their diminishing capabilities on your testes? I mean what has your experience been have the prunes been turned into raisins?

Amritia3ee wrote:

socal1976 wrote:Oh no Veejay is threatening to be mean to me. What shall I do?

Flee to Basel!

LOL Amiritia, and what is with the stream of consciousness on acid posts. Does the Veejster realize that we have invented things such as sentences and paragraphs in the english language? It is like trying to decipher the rosetta stone.

socal1976 wrote:Oh no Veejay is threatening to be mean to me. What shall I do? Again you seem to have a reading comprehension problem because your characterization of my position is one hundred percent wrong. So if you want to mischaracterizae and build straw men arguments you really aren't worth much more of my time. And Veejay you may have big steroid infused muscles in real life but you aren't very scary from behind a keyboard.

Then why do you say this to me?

"In short i suggest you calm down a bit especially your verbosity, say more in fewer words."

More contradiction from the so called attorney...seem to me like thats more reason to believe I am 100% correct and youre 100% wrong

Veejay

Perhaps, you're not calm... but not very scary

So not really a contradiction.

Can I ask for the matches he turned with cheating tactics?

I just want to be clear that they are factors affecting the outcomes of matches because obvious cheating as such will be remembered quite fondly and easily.

socal1976 wrote:Veejay, is it true what they say about steroids and their diminishing capabilities on your testes? I mean what has your experience been have the prunes been turned into raisins?

Changing the subject?
Why not stick to the subject and debate what I was talking about?

Besides I thought you said:
"you really aren't worth much more of my time."
and then you go on to say:
"your characterization of my position is one hundred percent wrong. "

I dont think I need to say more