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Roland Garros 2015: Daily Prediction Game, Day 13 Friday Semi Final

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:03 pm

noleisthebest wrote:With Fed...I suppose just the energy to last and compete in long rallies.
If he were he would not try to shorten rallies at all costs.

It's far too physical for him to be clean now even with all the talent.
I would tend to agree but he has lost so many matches because of his fitness. Even in 2011 v Djoko's USO semi, he had to gove up 2 sets to make sure he had enough energy for the 5th. A tactical move he was forced to adopted cause he was already tired in the 3rd. Same thing in USO 09.

It's difficult to project oneself at our age cause when I was younger I coudl play 8 hours on a tennis court....sure at an amateur level but without training nor eating even!

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:04 pm

Autumnleaf wrote:^^ I don't think so. What's the limit for 100 m? What's the limit for 10.000 or for climbing Alpe d'Huez?

I don't follow athletics any more...entire professional sport is up to its eyeballs in drugs.

At least in tennis I can enjoy a bit of flare but only just...that will soon go once Fed retires, unless a miracle happens.

Very sad, but true.

Money ruins everything.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:04 pm

Tenez wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:With Fed...I suppose just the energy to last and compete in long rallies.
If he were he would not try to shorten rallies at all costs.

It's far too physical for him to be clean now even with all the talent.
I would tend to agree but he has lost so many matches because of his fitness. Even in 2011 v Djoko's USO semi, he had to gove up 2 sets to make sure he had enough energy for the 5th. A tactical move he was forced to adopted cause he was already tired in the 3rd. Same thing in USO 09.

It's difficult to project oneself at our age cause when I was younger I coudl play 8 hours on a tennis court....sure at an amateur level but without training nor eating even!

But be honest, could you have played at this physical level?

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:06 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
Autumnleaf wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
Autumnleaf wrote:How would you know if you don't know who plays clean and who does not and moreover suspect that everybody is on drugs?

Where is the limit for clean players?
Because I play myself.
Well, unless you are a world class player, that doesn't mean you know. Even then it's tough, because physical limits DO differ between human beings.

You don't have to be a world class player to know what's physically possible and what's not.
It's quite easy, in fact.


No. What is your vo2 max? What is a fit athletes vo2 max? What is the vo2 max of an elite athlete?
I'm sorry but playing at your level isn't enough to gauge.

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Post by Autumnleaf on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:07 pm

noleisthebest wrote:I don't follow athletics any more...entire professional sport is up to its eyeballs in drugs.
The point was that the human limit is not known.

ETA: there even truly are "freaks of nature". In the 30ies there was a xc-skier who won every race because he suffered from a genetical defect that caused his RBC to rocket. Now that guy would have been a true loser of the epo-era.


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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:09 pm

luvsports! wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
Autumnleaf wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
Autumnleaf wrote:How would you know if you don't know who plays clean and who does not and moreover suspect that everybody is on drugs?

Where is the limit for clean players?
Because I play myself.
Well, unless you are a world class player, that doesn't mean you know. Even then it's tough, because physical limits DO differ between human beings.

You don't have to be a world class player to know what's physically possible and what's not.
It's quite easy, in fact.



No. What is your vo2 max? What is a fit athletes vo2 max? What is the vo2 max of an elite athlete?
I'm sorry but playing at your level isn't enough to gauge.

What makes an athlete "elite" these days, LS?

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:10 pm

Autumnleaf wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:I don't follow athletics any more...entire professional sport is up to its eyeballs in drugs.
The point was that the human limit is not known.

Of course it is!
The rest is propaganda Winking

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:13 pm

It's only drugs that make "elite" athletes looks superhuman and push limits now.

Why would a 21st century sprinter be any better than the 20th century one?

I agree, athletes can afford better training regimes etc...but our bodies are the same...and have been the same from day one: bones, muscles, heart, mind, soul...just silly media brainwashing us we are getting "better"...

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:14 pm

gallery play wrote:Waw can't stand the heat
coupled with the crowd filling his ears and mind! Must be tough out there.

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:14 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
luvsports! wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
Autumnleaf wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:
Autumnleaf wrote:How would you know if you don't know who plays clean and who does not and moreover suspect that everybody is on drugs?

Where is the limit for clean players?
Because I play myself.
Well, unless you are a world class player, that doesn't mean you know. Even then it's tough, because physical limits DO differ between human beings.

You don't have to be a world class player to know what's physically possible and what's not.
It's quite easy, in fact.



No. What is your vo2 max? What is a fit athletes vo2 max? What is the vo2 max of an elite athlete?
I'm sorry but playing at your level isn't enough to gauge.

What makes an athlete "elite" these days, LS?

Definitely not someone who plays for a club, no offence. Top 50 for sure.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:16 pm

With tennis, it's different as it also requires hand to eye coordination, so not exclusively physical, which is why that's the last bastion of any enjoyment in following sport.

If equipment: strings, balls are kept in check, it can still be great to watch for a long time...but it's not.

Thanks to Nadal, the X factor man, TDs have killed tennis...

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Post by Autumnleaf on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:18 pm

noleisthebest wrote:It's only drugs that make "elite" athletes looks superhuman and push limits now.

Why would a 21st century sprinter be any better than the 20th century one?

I agree, athletes can afford better training regimes etc...but our bodies are the same...and have been the same from day one: bones, muscles, heart, mind, soul...just silly media brainwashing us we are getting "better"...
Only in the very basics. In truth we are all different and that's why the human limit is hard to gauge. Very rare genetic deviations can cause gaps in performance.

No, 21st century sprinters would not necessarily be better than 20th century sprinters. But the individual starting the 21st century could be better (suited to the sport) than the individual starting in the 20th century.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:20 pm

Anyway...as I say, I feel for players now...they work so hard and have to put up with these dreadful balls, incurring blisters, aching in their bodies, just so Babolat can make tons of profit.

And people like Bernardes can't even do their job.

The sooner Nadal retires the better, and his loss here is a big step towards it, I hope!


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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:22 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:With Fed...I suppose just the energy to last and compete in long rallies.
If he were he would not try to shorten rallies at all costs.

It's far too physical for him to be clean now even with all the talent.
I would tend to agree but he has lost so many matches because of his fitness. Even in 2011 v Djoko's USO semi, he had to gove up 2 sets to make sure he had enough energy for the 5th. A tactical move he was forced to adopted cause he was already tired in the 3rd. Same thing in USO 09.

It's difficult to project oneself at our age cause when I was younger I coudl play 8 hours on a tennis court....sure at an amateur level but without training nor eating even!

But be honest, could you have played at this physical level?
I have never been a great athlete...and I believe Federer is naturally one, raised in the swiss Alps...but regardless, I have never been impressed by one of Federer's physical performance. Can you name one where he has been amazing? Let's not forget, they stop every other game for 1mn30 to rest entirely.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:28 pm

noleisthebest wrote:..The  sooner Nadal retires the better, and his loss here is a big step towards it, I hope!

Nadal wasn't the first and won't be the last. He certainly made it more obvious.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:30 pm

Tenez wrote:
I have never been a great athlete...and I believe Federer is naturally one, raised in the swiss Alps...but regardless, I have never been impressed by one of Federer's physical performance. Can you name one where he has been amazing? Let's not forget, they stop every other game for 1mn30 to rest entirely.
Nadal is a great natural athlete, as well (underneath all that fake muscle, of course).
The thing that separates them as tennis players is talent.

Also, at this level of physical exertion, with these balls, I don't think 1.30 is enough for them to recover esp if long rallies have been played.

It's the legs that are affected more than anything.

I was impressed with Fed beating Monfils at USO last year, although Monfils totally threw the 5th set away.


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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:35 pm

Tenez wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:..The  sooner Nadal retires the better, and his loss here is a big step towards it, I hope!

Nadal wasn't the first and won't be the last. He certainly made it more obvious.

Yes, but he pushed it to the breaking point, that's why many look hybrid and play this plastic tennis now, and it's harder to see talent underneath all that drill and spin.

I have nothing against talent using any help to make the game watchable...Henin was another one.

That's why I could never warm to Serena...despite her great talent she made the game so physical, Henin had to retire.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:46 pm

noleisthebest wrote:

It's the legs that are affected more than anything.
Actually the legs can go a long way. In tennis it's the precision that goes first.

I was impressed with Fed beating Monfils at USO last year, although Monfils totally threw the 5th set away.
Maybe but he certainly had nothing left the following match. Whereas a doper would typically do well then. We have seen Djoko and Nadal lining those incredibly tough matches one after the other....Federer? Never.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:54 pm

Looks like Wawrinka will still be the better equipped to beat Djko/Murray.....so I am hoping he wins in 4.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:58 pm

Tenez wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:

It's the legs that are affected more than anything.
Actually the legs can go a long way. In tennis it's the precision that goes first.

I was impressed with Fed beating Monfils at USO last year, although Monfils totally threw the 5th set away.
Maybe but he certainly had nothing left the following match. Whereas a doper would typically do well then. We have seen Djoko and Nadal lining those incredibly tough matches one after the other....Federer? Never.

We'll have to agree to disagree here, then.

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:59 pm

Tsonga is playing safe tennis that won't work against Murray or Djoko but is tiring and frustrating stan.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:02 pm

Poor Stan after netting that volley...

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:05 pm

luvsports! wrote:Tsonga is playing safe tennis that won't work against Murray or Djoko but is tiring and frustrating stan.
Yes, that's the annoying part of this afternoon.
Stan gets frustrated and exhausted but under normal circumstances we could have a good final. With either Tsonga or a dehydrated Stan the final is a foregone conclusion.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:06 pm

Tsonga is going on crowd fumes here....

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:06 pm

COMEEEE ONNNNNNN!!!! 3RD SET STAN! What was Tsonga thinking?

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:06 pm

Come on Stan!!!!
And now a nice and easy 6-2 please

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:08 pm

That was one supergutsy BH winner from Stan that turned the TB!

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:10 pm

All I can say, Nishi must've played a really rubbish match to lose to Tsonga....

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:10 pm

OTF posters, how's the weather at your place?

Here in Holland it's 34C.. I think it's actually hotter now than during that famous 2006 RG final.
It must be between 45 and 50 degrees on court.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:12 pm

I was just in the garden...felt like early 20s in Berks.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:12 pm

Why is it they allow the courts to be watered when it is Tsonga Stan and not Nole Nadal? This is absurd!

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:15 pm

Tenez wrote:Why is it they allow the courts to be watered when it is Tsonga Stan and not Nole Nadal? This is absurd!
Awful, isn't it?

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:15 pm

Tenez wrote:Why is it they allow the courts to be watered when it is Tsonga Stan and not Nole Nadal? This is absurd!
Well it's about 15 degrees hotter now. I can tell it's not hot in London Winking

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:19 pm

2-0, big hold!

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:20 pm

Stan's face looks like a tomato. It's amazing he still has the power.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:22 pm

gallery play wrote:OTF posters, how's the weather at your place?

Here in Holland it's 34C.. I think it's actually hotter now than during that famous 2006 RG final.
It must be between 45 and 50 degrees on court.
Yikes


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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:24 pm

Around 6:00 heavy thunderstorms are expected. Temperature will drop dramactically. What does this mean for the second match? I don't know

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:25 pm

Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:OTF posters, how's the weather at your place?

Here in Holland it's 34C.. I think it's actually hotter now than during that famous 2006 RG final.
It must be between 45 and 50 degrees on court.
Yikes

Yeah, so you can imagine how hot it is on Chartier court

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:39 pm

Tsonga 1/17 on bp's.....

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:49 pm

And Stan on 14/3..

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:52 pm

gallery play wrote:
Yikes

Yeah, so you can imagine how hot it is on Chartier court[/quote]
Thanks for the breeze. Without it it woudl be over 60C.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:56 pm

Wawrinka needs to a deluge after this match! Making Djoko and Murray play tomorrow woudl really up his odds.

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:00 pm

Come on Stan 2 more points and you're there!

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Post by luvsports! on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:01 pm

STAN THE MAN!

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:04 pm

Sad for Tsonga...but I agree it slightly makes it more exciting for Sunday.

Right now for the next match we want to see blood on red dust!

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Post by gallery play on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:19 pm

Tenez wrote:

Right now for the next match we want to see blood on red dust!

For starters!

gallery play

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:32 pm

gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:

Right now for the next match we want to see blood on red dust!

For starters!


What a stater for a first game!

Tenez

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:34 pm

Murray ain't gonna last long in this mode...already taking ages for his serve.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:36 pm

...and walks to towel himself after hitting an ace...

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:40 pm

This is a very painful watching, I don't even want to know what it must feel like to play there now.

There is going to be some serious dehydration after two sets.

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