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ATP 250: Queens, Halle

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Post by truffin1 on Thu Jun 12, 2014 4:47 pm

Did Fed struggle just trying to transition to the grass or do you think 1st set was lingering confidence worries about the back from yesterday.     I haven't seen the match, but read reports varying between: "he's done and needs to retire"   to  "He look brilliant once he found his range"

I wish that great form patch early in the year was moved to this time of the year!

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Post by noleisthebest on Thu Jun 12, 2014 4:50 pm

Tenez wrote:He is good isn;'t it? And the whole thing looks effortless.


Have you ever tried to hit a full-on FHDTL like he does?

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Post by Veejay on Thu Jun 12, 2014 4:58 pm

murray out.... Big Grin 
that REALLY made my day....
was feeling so down and depressed earlier on...now we dont have to hear from sue barker et al drooling over murray for the rest of the week-thank god for that!
heres hoping to an early exit at wimbledon too

really good match from stephanik

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Post by noleisthebest on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:00 pm

truffin1 wrote:Did Fed struggle just trying to transition to the grass or do you think 1st set was lingering confidence worries about the back from yesterday.     I haven't seen the match, but read reports varying between: "he's done and needs to retire"   to  "He look brilliant once he found his range"

I wish that great form patch early in the year was moved to this time of the year!

I didn't notice any back problem, Tenez is the one to answer that question.

To me, it was a simple transition performance, getting used to different bounce and hight compared to clay.
Fed was a bit conservative and subdued in the first set which is why he lost it. Poor timing on BH returns.
He looked and played like an old man with the same speed as Sousa, and naturally took no advantage of the fast surface.
As soon as he started hitting the ball with confidence, he was back to his deadly self, rushing Sousa and making him look plain and helpless.

I picked him to win Wimbledon.

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Post by noleisthebest on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:01 pm

Veejay wrote:murray out.... Big Grin 
that REALLY made my day....
was feeling so down and depressed earlier on...now we dont have to hear from sue barker et al drooling over murray for the rest of the week-thank god for that!
heres hoping to an early exit at wimbledon too

really good match from stephanik

Wow! Didn't see it, but not surprised....maybe Step the Stud was trying to impress Amelie...  Whistle 

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Post by truffin1 on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:02 pm

Tenez: I have been wondering why no news or paint job for Fed's racquet after all this time...  I think we both thought for sure the marketing was going to start before clay...   Finally, Wilson is releasing it.. 

Called the ProStaff RF97 and it is blacked out paint still!  A full line of racquets for various skill levels,etc

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Post by Veejay on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:42 pm

i just heard nadal is (0-1) 0-5 down in the second set 
its turning out to a wonderful day 
lets hope he gets bageled  Big Grin  Big Grin  Big Grin

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Post by Tenez on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:50 pm

truffin1 wrote:Did Fed struggle just trying to transition to the grass or do you think 1st set was lingering confidence worries about the back from yesterday.     I haven't seen the match, but read reports varying between: "he's done and needs to retire"   to  "He look brilliant once he found his range"

I wish that great form patch early in the year was moved to this time of the year!

I only saw bits of the first and 2nd sets....Impossible to say. I thought his return game was actually not bad considering the horrible shade/light sequences covering the court.

He finished strong and that is what matters. Let's see how he plays tomorrow (the day after) that will answer some questions.

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Post by Veejay on Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:54 pm

nadal beaten by dustin brown (81) 6-4 6-1
looks like he'll be knocked out of wimbledon in the first round again  Cool  Laugh

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Post by Tenez on Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:06 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
truffin1 wrote:Did Fed struggle just trying to transition to the grass or do you think 1st set was lingering confidence worries about the back from yesterday.     I haven't seen the match, but read reports varying between: "he's done and needs to retire"   to  "He look brilliant once he found his range"

I wish that great form patch early in the year was moved to this time of the year!

I didn't notice any back problem, Tenez is the one to answer that question.
Easy for me! He wins he is fine! he loses he is not! Winking

Joke apart, it's pretty much true! Having said that I did not notice much but I noticed , like in the FO, that he was not trying too hard. Was it to prevent injuries or because he feels not quite right I don't know. But shoudl he get further down the draw at Wimby we shoudl see him give a bit more.


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Post by Tenez on Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:08 pm

Veejay wrote:i just heard nadal is (0-1) 0-5 down in the second set 
its turning out to a wonderful day 
lets hope he gets bageled  Big Grin  Big Grin  Big Grin


 Doh 

It shows that Nadal will most likely not give Wimby a full effort.

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Post by noleisthebest on Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:37 pm

Veejay wrote:nadal beaten by dustin brown (81) 6-4 6-1
looks like he'll be knocked out of wimbledon in the first round again  Cool  Laugh
Veejay,
You are bringing some seriously good news today!  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 3755116760 

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Post by Daniel on Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:27 pm

When shot making is needed, Nadal has no answer.  Lucky boy to avoid Federer on grass so many years, and lucky that tennis has gotten rid of it to the point of extinction.  useless 1 dimensional moonballer.

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Post by truffin1 on Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:23 pm

Fed was always going to have a matchup problem with Nadal under this era of conditions- but this Halle debacle for Nadal once again shows how the H2H is unfairly created through his "picking and choosing when to meet Fed" whether by him winning on good conditions for his style or losing on conditions he didn't like- -

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Post by noleisthebest on Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:39 pm

Very true.
Not only was he picking and choosing, conditions were slowed down so he had a chance to pick and choose, and even then struggled.
Fed beat him convincingly  both times in O2, Nole as well in the final last year.
Nadal will never win WTF. The only number one among the "greats" without that title.
Says a lot, doesn't it?
No wonder he's been moaning about it not being on clay.
Imagine the tour a'la Nadal: as much time as "needed" between the points, on court coaching, 2 year protected ranking, no hard-courts, no grass, just claaaaaaay....

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 9:26 am

Match of the day:

Dimitrov-Dolgopolov
Brown-Kohlschreiber


.....and, again for Fed's sake only:

Federer-Lu

which will be another excellent grass preparation match for Fed as Lu is a first class grinder.
I am quite impressed he beat  Karlovic in two TBs yesterday.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 13, 2014 11:15 am

I only watched a few points from Nadal/Brown and clearly Nadal wanted to get out of there. I am surprised he decided to go early but he did not try to win that match....so it is not a very good reflection of what he coudl do if he wanted to (in ref to Wimbledon).

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 12:01 pm

Whether he wanted to win or not, that was one embarrassing exit yesterday.
He is too vain to be trounced like that.

I didn't see any of the match, but Brown can definitely play on grass, I remember seeing him lose to Mannarino in 5 sets in Wimbledon last year.

If nothing, he will have got reminded of the last two early exits there.
I think this year, the tour has matured and is better than before, so it's not going to be easy for him, unless he gets drawn the likes of F.Lopez  etc...
Even if he tried to hand-pick a "super lucky" draw for himself, it is going to be hard for him.
I am pretty sure Wimbledon are the same as every other tournament, so I love the fact that both Rosol and Darcis, who were thought to be guaranteed walkovers and a "lucky" draw for Nadal managed to knock him out.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 13, 2014 12:54 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
He is too vain to be trounced like that.

I didn't see any of the match, but Brown can definitely play on grass, I remember seeing him lose to Mannarino in 5 sets in Wimbledon last year.

If nothing, he will have got reminded of the last two early exits there.
I think this year, the tour has matured and is better than before, so it's not going to be easy for him, unless he gets drawn the likes of F.Lopez  etc...
Even if he tried to hand-pick a "super lucky" draw for himself, it is going to be hard for him.
I am pretty sure Wimbledon are the same as every other tournament, so I love the fact that both Rosol and Darcis, who were thought to be guaranteed walkovers and a "lucky" draw for Nadal managed to knock him out.

True! But that's why I think he wanted to show he did not care....and clearly it was obvious...which is a bit nasty considering the guest fee he pocketed.

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 13, 2014 2:21 pm

Why can Radek play his best at 35 and why can't fed at 32? Frustrating!

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 3:54 pm

Radek hasn't had anywhere near as much mileage on the clock as Fed...or maybe it's his love life!

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 3:58 pm

I haven't seen any tennis today, played instead as it's such a lovely day and you never know how long they are going to last here...hope I'm not late for Dolgo's and Brown's matches.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:07 pm

noleisthebest wrote:I haven't seen any tennis today, played instead as it's such a lovely day and you never know how long they are going to last here...hope I'm not late for Dolgo's and Brown's matches.

Late for both!
Looks like it was a huge battle between Kholi and Brown, Dolgo gave Dimi a w/o...
Well at least I'll get to see the King of Grass  Magic 

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:21 pm

Same here ...did not watch but wil hopefully catch up a bit of fed's game.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:49 pm

Just saw a bit of Nishi...he doesn't know how to play on grass at all.
I don't think many young players do in fact, esp the "percentage" generation.
It's funny to see him start almost every point the same way: a couple of baseline shots to open up the court.
No concept of attacking and forward moving.
Johnson is giving him a lesson in volleying tennis atm...

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Post by Polly 81 on Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:56 pm

Looks like Lu gave Fed a walkover too Sad No Dimi and no Fed today.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 5:06 pm

What a shame...
Hopefully he'll get to play tomorrow.
As for Dimi, I have realised I am not much of a fan.
Of all the "young" players I like Paire and Thiem most, even though they are not winning machines.

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:27 pm

Provided there are no walkovers, two promising matches tomorrow:

Fed-Nishi
Dimi-Stan

That's 3/4 SBH!   Bubbly

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Post by Tenez on Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:44 pm

Yes those should be good. What are the other 4? Step, Kholi, Lopez, ???

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Post by noleisthebest on Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:56 pm

You are right, I didn't even notice!

Feli-Step
Kholi-Falla

All quality players, 5/8 SBHs.

I wonder why Step never played with a SBH! His game is perfectly suited to it.
A good win for Lopez beating Berdych today.

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Post by Tenez on Sat Jun 14, 2014 12:29 am

noleisthebest wrote:You are right, I didn't even notice!

Feli-Step
Kholi-Falla

All quality players, 5/8 SBHs.

I wonder why Step never played with a SBH! His game is perfectly suited to it.
A good win for Lopez beating Berdych today.

Exactly my thoughts.

Yep, please for Lopez......maybe Nadal did not tank a few years ago v him at Queens!

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Post by Autumnleaf on Sat Jun 14, 2014 12:37 am

Just came back from Halle, it was such a great, great experience, met lots of interesting people, saw fascinating matches and got a good bodily impression of how a pro looks.  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 2231271509 So please forgive the long post, had to get rid of it. Big Grin 

Some notes:
- Monfils - Nishkikori (missed the first two that day, because I was late): Monfils is such a crowd pleaser! The emotions go right from the him to the crowd, a born entertainer, as a result they wanted him to win. I was surprised at Raonic going out, but the match was nothing to write home about.

- Fed - Sousa: crowd in shock after he lost the first set which in a way came out of nowhere, up until that point Sousa had barely won any points on the Fed serve, while Fed had several BPs. I was pretty anxious myself, because I really wanted to see the next Fed match. Big Grin Fortunately the next two matches weren't close.

- most boring match I have seen: Karlovic vs. Lu - I know, maybe I was just tired, but I almost fell asleep during that match. Hardly any interesting shots, some good volleys, but mostly serve, serve, serve, just like you expect from a Karlovic match.  sleepy 

- second Fed match of the day (the doubles; on center court because Johnson got a w/o): What stood out there was the difference in quality of shots between Fed and his partner Chiudinelli. Shots looked incredibly flat at times. Falla looked nothing special, how did he make semis?  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 759076010 

- could it get any better on one day: 2 Fed victories and a Nadal loss? Didn't see the first few games and when I came back, things didn't look too bright for Brown. Nadal had BPs in Brown's service game and Brown seemingly couldn't return the Nadal serve. But then it happened! Dustin Brown playing extremely aggressive and completely outplaying Nadal, who tbh looked very ordinary out there, one of the least impressive guys I have seen. I don't know whether he tanked the match, but his R1 exit in Wimbledon last year makes me think, he did not; he just isn't any better. How did he ever win Wimbledon?

- There were quite a few Nadalfans in the crowd. The girl behind me complained all the time, that his serve was not working and she got really sad when he lost. Her father remarked that everybody in the crowd was supporting Nadal, tennis being the only sport where the underdog gets little support. Which in that case wasn't really true because there were wild cheers for Dustin Brown too. (he thanked his friends  Magic ) Brown was quite the extrovert too, kissed the grass when the match was done, the crowd digged that and his speech which was charming.

The TD of course was beside himself at Nadal loss and found lots of excuses for the early (not unexpected) exit of the No. 1 seed. Pathetic, really.  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 3700139714  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 706916163  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 759076010  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 2355573927 

For me the only sad thing about Nadal losing is that he won't come back the next day to lose again.  Devil 

Dustin Brown would make a fine R1 opponent for Nadal in Wimbledon.  Thumbs Up 

- If Nadal had won, we would have got robbed of the greatest match, I have seen in Halle: Brown vs. Kohlschreiber. Unfortunately that day I hadn't got the good tix, but the atmosphere was incredible, especially during the breaks/ rebreaks, TB! Sure, the match mostly lived off the excitement of a really close match. And it had some good, aggressive shotmaking.

- The Fed match got canceled which was all to the good, because they did a public training on Court 1 instead. Since I was around that area anyway, I got a first row seat and the closest look you could ever get which is a treat.  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 3755116760 He played a quick set with some German guy Christopher Kas who had his birthday that day. Won it 6-0, including a successful tweener, that Kas returned but still lost the point. 

Looked very good out there, much better than the day before, where I thought he looked dead-tired in the face. Kas was soaked though! Not really in the shape to play Fed. Atmosphere was very relaxed, very different from a real game, especially since some guys (Halle statt Malle) cheered up the whole crowd by joking (They screamed e.g. "Roger, ich will Zwillinge von dir!!!"), so even Fed just had to smile about it and I'm sure he hears a lot.

I was surprised how incredibly easy it was to get access to all these guys, such as Fed. And they don't even really check the bags. They had a very superficial look into mine, not even all pockets and asked me whether I had hair spray. Well, I guess, most people have good intentions.  Whistle

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Post by summerblues on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:38 am

Welcome back autumnleaf.  Great to hear you had a good time.  I live on the US East Coast and I usually try to go to the US Open for at least one day each year, so I cannot complain, but there is a part of me that would really like to see a smaller tournament where everything is probably more intimate.

From what you wrote, it sounds like it must have been a really great experience.

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Post by summerblues on Sat Jun 14, 2014 4:28 am

Tenez wrote:Why can Radek play his best at 35 and why can't fed at 32? Frustrating!
But Radek does not really play his best.  He is around #40 in the rankings now while he used spend a lot of time in top 20.  As you yourself often say, at his best, Roger is even now not far off where he used to be.  The bigger challenge is to keep the consistency.  Roger - like Radek - can still play a one-off fabulous match.  But neither of them is able to produce the same level of day-in and day-out consistency they could produce in the past.

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Post by Tenez on Sat Jun 14, 2014 8:38 am

Glad you enjoyed it AL. I wish I had seen Nadal lose live. That's as good as it gets nowadays for me since Fed's uneven results.

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Post by Tenez on Sat Jun 14, 2014 8:42 am

summerblues wrote:
Tenez wrote:Why can Radek play his best at 35 and why can't fed at 32? Frustrating!
But Radek does not really play his best.  He is around #40 in the rankings now while he used spend a lot of time in top 20.  As you yourself often say, at his best, Roger is even now not far off where he used to be.  The bigger challenge is to keep the consistency.  Roger - like Radek - can still play a one-off fabulous match.  But neither of them is able to produce the same level of day-in and day-out consistency they could produce in the past.

yep, fair points.

I guess Radek's timing and anticipation also improve and make up for that loss of recovery power.

But that's what I would expect from Fed. Maybe Fed's game (beautiful oiled machine) is more sensitive to being rusty the following day.

As I often say the sharpest blades are the most fragile!

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 9:40 am

Tenez wrote:Glad you enjoyed it AL. I wish I had seen Nadal lose live. That's as good as it gets nowadays for me since Fed's uneven results.
I thought you saw him bagelled by Fed in O2...
I saw him lose there as well also to Fed in the final in 2010...never enough of that lovely feeling!

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 9:46 am

Autumnleaf wrote:
- There were quite a few Nadalfans in the crowd. The girl behind me complained all the time, that his serve was not working and she got really sad when he lost.

Looked very good out there, much better than the day before, where I thought he looked dead-tired in the face. Kas was soaked though! Not really in the shape to play Fed. Atmosphere was very relaxed, very different from a real game, especially since some guys (Halle statt Malle) cheered up the whole crowd by joking (They screamed e.g. "Roger, ich will Zwillinge von dir!!!"), so even Fed just had to smile about it and I'm sure he hears a lot.
German sense of humour...  Doh 

I had a very annoying Chinese woman Nadal fan sit in front of me, as well,  I can completely understand Llodra's reaction from IW .

Good of Halle to put on that exhibition with Fed after his match got cancelled. Nothing beats seeing Maestro live and close-up.
You've been very fortunate to have the opportunity.
The guy who sat next to me in Paris actually flew in for the weekend from Perth in Australia to watch Nadal!!!!

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Post by Tenez on Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:20 am

noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:Glad you enjoyed it AL. I wish I had seen Nadal lose live. That's as good as it gets nowadays for me since Fed's uneven results.
I thought you saw him bagelled by Fed in O2...
I saw him lose there as well also to Fed in the final in 2010...never enough of that lovely feeling!
No - I did not see that one live. I saw the Fed Tsonga final and Delpo v Davydenko in o2.

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 12:30 pm

Sorry, I must've mixed you up with someone else from v2, quite a few people went that year.

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Post by summerblues on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:07 pm

I cannot believe how close Falla has kept the match the first two sets.

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Post by summerblues on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:29 pm

Watching Dimi vs Stan, but cannot believe the scores from the Kohli vs Falla match.  Kohli was a break up in the third, and now has to serve to stay in the match.

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Post by summerblues on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:34 pm

Falla wins  ATP 250: Queens, Halle - Page 2 759076010

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:50 pm

Finally've got some time to watch!

I don't know why people are surprosed with Falla, he nearly knocked Fed in 5 sets out of Wimbledon a few years ago.
The guy can play!

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Post by summerblues on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:52 pm

Nice win for Dimi.  At Wimbledon, he will have his first good chance to reach top 10.  Even if he fails to do it there, I will be very disappointed if he is not in top 10 by the end of the USO.

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Post by summerblues on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:54 pm

noleisthebest wrote:I don't know why people are surprosed with Falla, he nearly knocked Fed in 5 sets out of Wimbledon a few years ago.
The guy can play!
Fed was not playing exactly great there.

But I admit, I may be underestimating Falla.  I was just expecting Kohli to win, and was looking forward to Fed vs Kohli tomorrow.  Maybe I will watch Falla vs Nishi instead.

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:55 pm

Grass is definitely not working for heavy-legged this year: Berdych, Raonic, Stan...they are all out.
To think that Stan is going to be be third seed in Wimbledon!


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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 3:10 pm

Fed Nishi started, 3:2.
The court looks like a mudpit, worse than Wimbledon after two weeks.
Nishi's net clearance 77cm, Fed's 56.
Fed looks in the mood, excellent BH striking!

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 3:15 pm

Fed breaks! diva
Haven't seen him in this edition for some time Bubbly

What a volley.....

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Jun 14, 2014 3:28 pm

Fed takes the 1st set 6:3 with ease.
Nadal was right, Nishi is fast when you give him time, but with a hungry and motivated looking Federer, he certainly is not getting any time, quite the opposite.
Some really gorgeous tennis from him right now....

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