Search
 
 

Display results as :
 


Rechercher Advanced Search

Latest topics
» How strong is Nadal mentally?
Today at 9:10 am by ...

» ATP Masters 1000: Cincinnati
Today at 8:24 am by Tenez

» 10 Years Ago...
Today at 4:09 am by summerblues

» US OPEN 2017
Today at 4:07 am by summerblues

» Sharapova announces failed drug test
Yesterday at 9:53 pm by Jahu

» Will Federer and Nadal Finally Meet At The US Open?
Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:45 am by Daniel

» Canadian Masters 1000
Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:27 am by legendkillar

» Another record for Federer coming up?
Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:46 pm by Daniel

» The doping program joke of the ITF!!!
Mon Aug 14, 2017 2:51 pm by legendkillar

August 2017
MonTueWedThuFriSatSun
 123456
78910111213
14151617181920
21222324252627
28293031   

Calendar Calendar

Affiliates
free forum


Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by summerblues on Fri Jan 24, 2014 5:56 pm

I posted a Rafa/Roger only version of this on 606v2; here I added Nole and Andy.  A few observations:

1. Throughout all of their careers I thought that Rafa would likely fail to overhaul Roger's slam count.  Now, for the first time, I am inclined to give Rafa better than 50/50 chance of making it.

2. When Nole was winning everything, I think I made a guess that he would fail to get beyond (or even reach, cannot remember) 10 slams.  While Nole can still get there, he does look like he got a bit stuck.  If he wants to reach 10, he will need to quickly rediscover his slam winning magic.  Getting rid of Boris would be a good first step, in my mind Winking

3. The chart also nicely illustrates that - in spite of people talking of "Big 4" - how far behind Murray and, to a lesser extent, Nole are.  It is really a two horse race between Roger and Rafa.


summerblues

Posts : 2862
Join date : 2012-05-19

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Daniel on Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:14 pm

he hasn't got 14 yet.

Daniel

Posts : 2848
Join date : 2013-11-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by DECIMA on Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:17 pm

He's still on 13 slams.

DECIMA

Posts : 4241
Join date : 2013-05-03

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:21 pm

FedererKing wrote:he hasn't got 14 yet.
And as we learnt with LA, trophies might come and go!

having said that 17 is certainly a realistic number...if Djoko does not wake up.....and/or th enew generation does not step in! Nadal looked mighty powerful today...for some reasons much more than outside slams!

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by summerblues on Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:24 pm

FedererKing wrote:he hasn't got 14 yet.
Julia Santamaria wrote:He's still on 13 slams.

I know and I am not into jinxing (at least not as much as some here Winking).  It may not be very visible but the line from 13 to 14 is not a solid line but a dashed-line - indicating where he would be if he were to win on Sunday.

summerblues

Posts : 2862
Join date : 2012-05-19

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:34 pm

the 7 Wimbledon record is safe..and still the most important!

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Daniel on Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:55 pm

Tenez wrote:the 7 Wimbledon record is safe..and still the most important!

Yeah, totally.  It's even more impressive that Fed managed that in the slow-ass era.

Daniel

Posts : 2848
Join date : 2013-11-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by BlueClay on Fri Jan 24, 2014 7:06 pm

summerblues wrote:
1. Throughout all of their careers I thought that Rafa would likely fail to overhaul Roger's slam count.  Now, for the first time, I am inclined to give Rafa better than 50/50 chance of making it.

if Nadal wins the AO final (which he will unless an Act of God prevents it) and gets to 14 slams, it is pretty much a given IMO that he will equal or even surpass Federer's slam record if he can remain injury free.

2. When Nole was winning everything, I think I made a guess that he would fail to get beyond (or even reach, cannot remember) 10 slams.  While Nole can still get there, he does look like he got a bit stuck.  If he wants to reach 10, he will need to quickly rediscover his slam winning magic.  Getting rid of Boris would be a good first step, in my mind Winking

I don't think Djokovic will get to 10 slams. I think he will probably end his career with around 8.

BlueClay

Posts : 362
Join date : 2012-12-26

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by ... on Fri Jan 24, 2014 7:28 pm

I am still hopeful that Fed can win a slam or two.

Nole....needs to regroup asap. He won't break the record in this chart, but may be instrumental in preserving Fed's.

Perhaps, the key to the whole story may be this year's RG.

If Nole manages to win it and Fed's back holds in Wimbledon, USO is anyone's bet.
Murray looked good against Fed and he could also be "useful" in stopping Nadal.
Come next year, younger guard may be gaining more experience and confidence and even someone completely new turn out of nowhere.

One thing is for sure, Nadal has to be stopped!

...

Posts : 24511
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:02 pm

Right ....so 13 it is still...a lucky number!  Cool 

Now pressure on Nadal on defending all those clay points....including HC IW.

Still a 4 slams separating Nadal and Federer! That's the other great news of the day.

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Daniel on Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:53 pm

Stan stopped a nightmare tale today. Nadal...  being presented with a trophy from a guy he has just equalled in Slams.  A guy who has more talent than he ever could have.  Stan has made my day!  Glad he pulled it off!  What a way to break the losing streak.

Daniel

Posts : 2848
Join date : 2013-11-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by truffin1 on Sun Jan 26, 2014 5:05 pm

Stan the Man!!!!!

truffin1

Posts : 861
Join date : 2012-10-13

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 26, 2014 5:08 pm

FedererKing wrote:Stan stopped a nightmare tale today. Nadal...  being presented with a trophy from a guy he has just equalled in Slams.  A guy who has more talent than he ever could have.  Stan has made my day!  Glad he pulled it off!  What a way to break the losing streak.

He made my 2014!...so far!

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Polly 81 on Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:18 pm

To add to the stats already mentioned:
Nadal (aged 27) was going for his 14th major today having lost 5 finals
Federer (aged 27) won his 14th major having lost 5 finals

Polly 81

Posts : 340
Join date : 2013-11-07

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:49 pm

yes good stat! Polly!

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:13 pm

So now that Nadal lost his Last holding slam, what are the chances of him bettering Roger's 17?

I think he would still have a good chance ..if it was not for today performance. It was quite a poor display. Not sure what's wrong with him but his "team" will have to work something out.

I feel that his chances of winning more slams is very unlikely as the FO is by far his favourite one....and did not do too well there. he is unlikely to win the other slams now.

He will have to look at the bright side: His H2H v Federer...and will have to work very hard to not to have a bad H2H v Djoko cause this is going to affect his positive record he has v Federer.

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by ... on Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:30 pm

Nadal was quite odd today.

He was bluffing the entire match, in fact.

All he has now is the grunt and that vicious topspin, and may I say what a bity one!
But no spirit and confidence to drive it.

Of all 4 players I saw today (Nole, Murray and
Ferrer), his ball is by far the most powerful.
I thought his average shot was about 30% more powerful than Nole's.
In that first set, Nadal was able to push and keep Nole far behind the baseline, and that is no easy feat. He just has ridiculous power at his disposal.

His legs looked different from last year.
He just didn't have that smooth run to his FH and Nole didn't give it to him either.
I think Nole's frequent drop-shotting contributed a lot to Nadal's lack of rhythm.

And then when I thought Nadal was spent, he would again come out blazing his super juiced shots...any little dip of focus from Nole and he was ready to pounce.

Nadal would've beaten many other players today!

It's too early to completely write him off but he is on the ropes, that's for sure, that aura will be starting to fade fast in the locker room now.

The real problem is, as we have been saying all the time, he has no plan B.
The bicep is still there though, ready at the first sign of weakness.

...

Posts : 24511
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by legendkillar on Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:39 pm

He has gone mentally. It was a weak surrender it has to be said. Like you say the fortress that was RG is gone and next year he turns 30, so it would be unlikely he reaches the same heights of yesteryear.

If he ends the year slamless, I would say stick a fork in him. 

I think the wider question is can he break back into the top 4? He has points to gain during the American swing. We saw with Federer in 2013 when he dipped, but got back into the top 4. Murray in 2014 and he done it. I have grave reservations for Nadal as he now faces the potential prospect of playing more tournaments to beef those ranking points up.

legendkillar

Posts : 1818
Join date : 2012-10-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:56 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
Nadal would've beaten many other players today!
I am not sure actually. As I pointed out. he did not do any better than Nieminen. He certainly looked flat footed and if you compare his energy level with AO12....far from it.

It's too early to completely write him off but he is on the ropes, that's for sure, that aura will be starting to fade fast in the locker room now.

The real problem is, as we have been saying all the time, he has no plan B.
The bicep is still there though, ready at the first sign of weakness.
We have been hearing again about that time violation and I think this is his biggest problem. To be able to keep the intensity he still brings sometimes, he needs more time between points.

It's not a trivial thing. It's crucial for him. He would not have got into the trouble of tarnishing his reputation and put pressure on all referees just for the fun of it .

I think people are overlooking the effect of applying the time rule over in his loss of form...but they do coincide.

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Tenez on Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:59 pm

legendkillar wrote:He has gone mentally. It was a weak surrender it has to be said. Like you say the fortress that was RG is gone and next year he turns 30, so it would be unlikely he reaches the same heights of yesteryear.

If he ends the year slamless, I would say stick a fork in him. 

I think the wider question is can he break back into the top 4? He has points to gain during the American swing. We saw with Federer in 2013 when he dipped, but got back into the top 4. Murray in 2014 and he done it. I have grave reservations for Nadal as he now faces the potential prospect of playing more tournaments to beef those ranking points up.
His main challenge will be to face better players earlier in the draws. That is what should seriously affect his assault to the top. The very same reason why he lost today instead of the final.

Tenez

Posts : 16619
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by ... on Wed Jun 03, 2015 11:01 pm

You are right!

When I told Nouni that they (colleague umpires) needed to support Bernardes and give Nadal more time violations, he looked a bit apprehensive to put it mildly...
A lot is cooking behind the scenes...

...

Posts : 24511
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:21 am

noleisthebest wrote:You are right!

When I told Nouni that they (colleague umpires) needed to support Bernardes and give Nadal more time violations, he looked a bit apprehensive to put it mildly...
A lot is cooking behind the scenes...
You personally spoke to Kader Nouni? 

raiders_of_the_lost_ark

Posts : 2767
Join date : 2012-07-20

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by ... on Thu Jun 04, 2015 7:09 am

Yes.

...

Posts : 24511
Join date : 2012-06-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by legendkillar on Thu Jun 04, 2015 8:27 am

Tenez wrote:
legendkillar wrote:He has gone mentally. It was a weak surrender it has to be said. Like you say the fortress that was RG is gone and next year he turns 30, so it would be unlikely he reaches the same heights of yesteryear.

If he ends the year slamless, I would say stick a fork in him. 

I think the wider question is can he break back into the top 4? He has points to gain during the American swing. We saw with Federer in 2013 when he dipped, but got back into the top 4. Murray in 2014 and he done it. I have grave reservations for Nadal as he now faces the potential prospect of playing more tournaments to beef those ranking points up.
His main challenge will be to face better players earlier in the draws. That is what should seriously affect his assault to the top. The very same reason why he lost today instead of the final.

Will the better players though believe they can beat Nadal? Even this off colour version. Can Berdych back up his first victory over him? I really hope that these players can now walk out on court and not feel defeated. More so on the Clay.

legendkillar

Posts : 1818
Join date : 2012-10-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Roger, Rafa and the Big 4

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum