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ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

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ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Fri May 04, 2018 7:13 pm

Draw is out.

Nole- Nishi in round one. Enough said.

http://www.protennislive.com/posting/2018/1536/mds.pdf


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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Fri May 04, 2018 11:10 pm

This is a one sided draw in Nadal's favour. All the better players are on the other side. Delpo of course is the main threat there......but we don't know his form as he has not played on clay this year.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Sat May 05, 2018 2:23 pm

noleisthebest wrote:Nole- Nishi in round one.
Nishi is now unseeded, so he is liable to play seeds early. Lucky he is only playing Djokovic, who is a low seed, but not even playing to that standard. It could have been worse - he could have faced Zverev or Delpo in the first round.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Sat May 05, 2018 5:43 pm

summerblues wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:Nole- Nishi in round one.
Nishi is now unseeded, so he is liable to play seeds early.  Lucky he is only playing Djokovic, who is a low seed, but not even playing to that standard.  It could have been worse - he could have faced Zverev or Delpo in the first round.

but he definitely couldn't've faced Nadal, could he?

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Sat May 05, 2018 6:13 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
summerblues wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:Nole- Nishi in round one.
Nishi is now unseeded, so he is liable to play seeds early.  Lucky he is only playing Djokovic, who is a low seed, but not even playing to that standard.  It could have been worse - he could have faced Zverev or Delpo in the first round.

but he definitely couldn't've faced Nadal, could he?

Not in Madrid! Winking

I must say it's Nadal's best draw on clay this year.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by naxroy on Sat May 05, 2018 8:25 pm

delpo could hurt nadal if in good form, at least more than zverev, nishikori, thiem, goffin...

and who knows, maybe novak gets back his tennis some day before roland garros

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Sat May 05, 2018 10:05 pm

noleisthebest wrote:but he definitely couldn't've faced Nadal, could he?
Why not?  He could. Unless you think the draw is rigged.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Sat May 05, 2018 10:15 pm

summerblues wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:but he definitely couldn't've faced Nadal, could he?
Why not?  He could. Unless you think the draw is rigged.
It's not a certainty but you'd have to be credulous to think they never would.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Sat May 05, 2018 10:31 pm

Tenez wrote:
summerblues wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:but he definitely couldn't've faced Nadal, could he?
Why not?  He could. Unless you think the draw is rigged.
It's not a certainty but you'd have to be credulous to think they never would.
Oh I would not be surprised if they rigged the draws.  It would be difficult to prove and it would be the kind of thing they would probably not even feel too guilty about.  So all the ingredients are there.

But making 100% claims where one does not have 100% certainty is not right either.  And especially in nitb's case, where she is always certain that any bad decision or draw that goes against Nole is done on purpose, but where she blissfully ignores and forgets any bad decisions done in his favor.  Her hypocrisy is what rubs me the wrong way in these things.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Sun May 06, 2018 6:48 pm

Finally a decent match on the horizon tomorrow,  Nole-Nishi.

Don’t know how injured Nishi is, but clay in Madrid is fastish so he has an advantage over rusty Nole.

...

This must be the worst and weirdest clay season I can remember...totally disappointing - Pouille, Nishi, Dimi, Raonic, Fognini, Kokkinakis, Kyrgios...where are they all?

Anyone remembers Monfils and Simon?

Zverev apparently won Munich today, does anyone care about that boring robot...

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Sun May 06, 2018 10:17 pm

Madrid is Delpo's first tournament on clay this year. He is our last best hope. It is a long shot but at least he is a tough cookie and not a choker.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Sun May 06, 2018 11:06 pm

summerblues wrote:Madrid is Delpo's first tournament on clay this year.  He is our last best hope.  It is a long shot but at least he is a tough cookie and not a choker.
 Mine too. Or someone who has been totally new to Nadal  and has unique strong game. Someone like a Tiafoe

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by naxroy on Sun May 06, 2018 11:13 pm

tiafoe is not playing madrid, or am I wrong?

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Sun May 06, 2018 11:54 pm

Looks like Souza is teh man in form.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Sun May 06, 2018 11:56 pm

naxroy, I know this is Madrid thread but I, and I suspect rotla too, are also thinking in terms of who could beat Rafa at RG, that is why I think he mentions Tiafoe.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Sun May 06, 2018 11:59 pm

Sousa? I have never seen him play. Are you serious? Is he playing well? Sounds pretty desperate if Sousa is our man vs Nadal for the FO.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Mon May 07, 2018 3:24 am

noleisthebest wrote:Anyone remembers Monfils and Simon?
Yes!  I do:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33XvFCfo2O8

But also, Monfils could be Rafa's first opponent in Madrid.  If he upsets him, we will all remember him so much better.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Mon May 07, 2018 8:56 am

That match was great!
I still remember we had lots of fun commenting on it here.

They played like it was a picnic; Monfils chillin’ in the changeover drinking Coke; elegant, grunt-free shots...

Those were the days! Bubbly

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by naxroy on Mon May 07, 2018 11:59 am

summerblues wrote:naxroy, I know this is Madrid thread but I, and I suspect rotla too, are also thinking in terms of who could beat Rafa at RG, that is why I think he mentions Tiafoe.


apart fron injury, only top form djokovic can beat nadal at roland garros

imo

I would be very surprised if a different player beat nadal in bo5... of course, things happen in sport, but cant see it right now

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Mon May 07, 2018 4:01 pm

Nole def playing clean now.

Will be good once he gains confidence; funny to see Nishi being happy to extend rallies.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Mon May 07, 2018 4:32 pm

Am not watching but would be good if he coudl become a force just in time.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Mon May 07, 2018 5:30 pm

So, a straight sets win, flat match.
Was weird to see a 12 slam holder and a slam finalist in round one like reconvalescents.

With Nishi it manifested itself in low spirit, with Nole in missing a full step with his movement.

To me, Nole looks a very different man.
Call it Nole 3.0 version.

He was not a beast today, but the beast was definitely somewhere inside him, hungry for wins.

He looks thinner than in his peak, especially his legs.

If anything, he appears slightly sedated, coming out of a very strange slumber.

He definitely needs matches, a lot of.

There was wincing in one of the changeovers, not sure what that was...he didn’t like that the camera caught it.

I think he is striking the ball flatter now and his game looks cleaner.

I can’t imagine him lasting a 5 setter on clay, but we’ll see.

There’s rumours Becker is returning.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Mon May 07, 2018 6:22 pm

I never thought I'd support Nole over Nishi but on this occasion I wanted your man to win as he is a bit more of a fighter than Nishi. I think if he faces Nadal it might give him wings......long way to go though.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Mon May 07, 2018 8:24 pm

Nole is far from his best.
It’s not just the confidence, but also consistency and movement which were his main weapon. Without those, his shots won’t take him far, despite improvement.

Plus he looks really raw and unhealed inside...almost desperate, yes, that’s the right word.

At this stage of clay season, I am desperate, too, as a tennis fan...for a decent match!

Some interesting ones tomorrow:

Lajovic -Gasquet
Tsitsipas - Zverev
Shapo - Paire (Shapo said he’s happy with any wins...as he is still learning how to move on clay and translate his game there).

I can’t repeat enough how horrid this clay season has been...nobody seems to care...

I noticed that flatness since AO17 when I was commenting on how indifferent Fognini and Tsonga were...it feels like the entire tour has burnt out!

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Tue May 08, 2018 1:53 am

naxroy wrote:... of course, things happen in sport, but cant see it right now
Sadly, I agree with you Sad

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Tue May 08, 2018 1:56 am

Tenez wrote:Am not watching but would be good if he coudl become a force just in time.
I am sure it is way too late for him for RG.  But maybe he still has enough time to get better and win Wimbledon.  I don't know if that would be good enough for you. Winking

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 7:14 am

Judging by this smash, Nole is definitely getting close to his old form Big Grin

https://mobile.twitter.com/VinnMedOss/status/993520796554485760/video/1

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 10:25 am

summerblues wrote:
Tenez wrote:Am not watching but would be good if he coudl become a force just in time.
I am sure it is way too late for him for RG.  But maybe he still has enough time to get better and win Wimbledon.  I don't know if that would be good enough for you. Winking
Yeah I thought about it. But from now on, I'd trade any future Fed's slam v Nadal not having one more. Nadal has simply over achieved!

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Tue May 08, 2018 11:04 am

Tenez wrote:
summerblues wrote:
Tenez wrote:Am not watching but would be good if he coudl become a force just in time.
I am sure it is way too late for him for RG.  But maybe he still has enough time to get better and win Wimbledon.  I don't know if that would be good enough for you. Winking
Yeah I thought about it. But from now on, I'd trade any future Fed's slam v Nadal not having one more. Nadal has simply over achieved!

Why do you say that? Is there any slam he won which he should have lost?

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 11:24 am

raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:
Tenez wrote:
summerblues wrote:
Tenez wrote:Am not watching but would be good if he coudl become a force just in time.
I am sure it is way too late for him for RG.  But maybe he still has enough time to get better and win Wimbledon.  I don't know if that would be good enough for you. Winking
Yeah I thought about it. But from now on, I'd trade any future Fed's slam v Nadal not having one more. Nadal has simply over achieved!

Why do you say that? Is there any slam he won which he should have lost?

All those he played outside the 25s rule...to start with!

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 11:43 am

This Caja Magica is not good for tennis.
There always seems to be part of the court in shade making it very difficult to watch the ball.

Shapo's serve works really well on clay!

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 12:07 pm

And Shapo wins set one in the TB.
There was an admirable attempt of Paire to S&V at 5:5, nice to see (even though he volleyed out).

Haase destroyed Chung...is Chung injured?
He seems even more fragile than Nishi!

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 12:16 pm

noleisthebest wrote:And Shapo wins set one in the TB.
There was an admirable attempt of Paire to S&V at 5:5, nice to see (even though he volleyed out).

Haase destroyed Chung...is Chung injured?
He seems even more fragile than Nishi!

Must be. The way he threw away a possible 4/1 lead v Zverev in that semi was really weird.

yep fragfile cause to play like Nole it is very demanding. Only Nadal seems to be able to sustain the fitness side of those gruelling games.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 12:41 pm

wow.....how nervous both are.

Paire pulling 3 DFs n a row while trying to serve for the set.

Shapo DFing on trying to save BPs.

That's my worry with Shapo. Talented but the brain?

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 12:50 pm

Tenez wrote:
raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:
Tenez wrote:
summerblues wrote:
Tenez wrote:Am not watching but would be good if he coudl become a force just in time.
I am sure it is way too late for him for RG.  But maybe he still has enough time to get better and win Wimbledon.  I don't know if that would be good enough for you. Winking
Yeah I thought about it. But from now on, I'd trade any future Fed's slam v Nadal not having one more. Nadal has simply over achieved!

Why do you say that? Is there any slam he won which he should have lost?

All those he played outside the 25s rule...to start with!

To this I will add the chance he managed to be the first one to raise the physical bar so high suddenly. Nowadays, it is much harder as the others have caught up (in part at least) with the fitness side.

And last but not least, the fact he and the other road runners faced a generation who learnt to play the game with smaller frames and nat gut. Again the new gen has not got that luck.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 12:57 pm

Shapo is also a basher. A talented one but a basher. He should make a better effort in controlling the pace of his shots. They are brilliant when they go in.....but they would look as good if they were to go it with a bit more safety...a la federer. he makes UEs....which even I woudl not.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by naxroy on Tue May 08, 2018 1:19 pm

noleisthebest wrote:This Caja Magica is not good for tennis.
There always seems to be part of the court in shade making it very difficult to watch the ball.

Shapo's serve works really well on clay!


Dominique Perrault was the architect. I kind of think the same regarding that shadow

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 1:31 pm

Tenez wrote:Shapo is also a basher. A talented one but a basher. He should make a better effort in controlling the pace of his shots. They are brilliant when they go in.....but they would look as good if they were to go it with a bit more safety...a la federer. he makes UEs....which even I woudl not.

I disagree.

He is just very loose and anti-percentage, which is not surprising for a young player with a SBH in this latest era.

His game is exclusively i stinctive, so for me that can never be a basher.
Similar but not the same as Dolgo.

His mother gets on my nerves with that husky soft toy “support”...I feel sorry for Shapo.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 1:33 pm

Tenez wrote:wow.....how nervous both are.

Paire pulling 3 DFs n a row while trying to serve for the set.

Shapo DFing on trying to save BPs.

That's my worry with Shapo. Talented but the brain?
Didn’t see sets 2&3 but glad Shapo won.

Paire’s lost his initial love for the game, he looks like he is more worried about the shape of his beard these days...shame.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 1:37 pm

What is going on with Fognini...losing generously these days. Hooefully will string a few wins next week in Rome.

They don’t make ‘em like that any more!

Hopefully Tsitsipas makes it to round 2 to meet Zverev!

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 1:47 pm

noleisthebest wrote:
Tenez wrote:Shapo is also a basher. A talented one but a basher. He should make a better effort in controlling the pace of his shots. They are brilliant when they go in.....but they would look as good if they were to go it with a bit more safety...a la federer. he makes UEs....which even I woudl not.

I disagree.

He is just very loose and anti-percentage, which is not surprising for a young player  with a SBH in this latest era.

His game is exclusively i stinctive, so for me that can never be a basher.
Similar but not the same as Dolgo.

His mother gets on my nerves with that husky soft toy “support”...I feel sorry for Shapo.
You might disagree but I am still right! Winking

In fact 2 games later I posted that the commentator was talking about it. he makes too many unecessary UEs. He is a kind of Leconte. great when everything clicks in.....but doesn't have the safety in his shots and that is crucial to win slams galore, otherwise he is going to face many upsets in his career.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 3:20 pm

Tenez wrote:
You might disagree but I am still right! Winking
Time will tell!
Tenez wrote:
In fact 2 games later I posted that the commentator was talking about it. he makes too many unecessary UEs. He is a kind of Leconte. great when everything clicks in.....but doesn't have the safety in his shots and that is crucial to win slams galore, otherwise he is going to face many upsets in his career.
Since when do I care about what commentators say? Cool

Bottom line is Shapo has landed into a weird DBH physical era and has only just turned 19.
This time last year he apparently recorded 7 consecutive losses in Challengers’ circuit.

It’s a very different world to the tennis Fed came to when he was 19.

Though I think we all agree that there is only one Fed! Magic

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 3:25 pm

Time won't tell. Either he starts to play within himself like all champs do....or he won't win as much as he could.

It's key to cut on those many stupid UEs.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 4:54 pm

I agree he can be casual and generous with UEs.

It hasn’t sunk with him he is a pro now and he is there for winning, not just “trying to improve/get better”.

Again, his mother holding soft toy in front of her does not help Shapo to grow up, does it?

I can’t imagine Fed’s or any player’s mother do that, it’s beyond stupid and very selfish.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 5:29 pm

noleisthebest wrote:....
I can’t imagine Fed’s or any player’s mother do that, it’s beyond stupid and very selfish.
That was weird....but hadn'tFederer also mojo in his bag?

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 5:34 pm

Tenez wrote:
noleisthebest wrote:....
I can’t imagine Fed’s or any player’s mother do that, it’s beyond stupid and very selfish.
That was weird....but hadn'tFederer also mojo in his bag?
What do you mean?


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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 5:35 pm

Great tennis from Dusan Lajovic, the SBH pride of Serbia!

Go Duci! diva

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by Tenez on Tue May 08, 2018 5:43 pm

I seem to remember he had a teddy bear in his bag.

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by noleisthebest on Tue May 08, 2018 6:24 pm

Tenez wrote:I seem to remember he had a teddy bear in his bag.
In the personal bag is acceptable (only just at that age and because it’s Fed Big Grin)...but imagine his mother holding it in front of her.

Nah...tennis is not for boys, men only!

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

Post by summerblues on Wed May 09, 2018 5:10 am

noleisthebest wrote:Judging by this smash, Nole is definitely getting close to his old form Big Grin

https://mobile.twitter.com/VinnMedOss/status/993520796554485760/video/1
smiley

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Re: ATP Masters 1000: Madrid

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