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Federer - Emotive Player?

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Federer - Emotive Player? Empty Federer - Emotive Player?

Post by legendkillar on Sat Oct 13, 2012 7:58 pm

Watching the semi's on Sky earlier and just as Andy was to serve for the set, Peter Fleming (Legend that is) made the point that Federer plays on emotion slightly when facing Murray. Elludes to the fact that since Andy burst on the scene and became a main feature at the latter parts of tournaments and facing Federer, well that he just gets under Roger's skin and that there is something that Federer dislikes about Murray. I thought it was a valid point. Now there are 3 matches which stand out to me that adds a little credit to what Fleming is saying.

Montreal 2006 - Murray's first victory over Federer which pissed off the great man so much that he launched a ball out of the stadium afterwards.

Shanghai 2008 - Murray was already through to the semi's of the WTF. He beat Federer in 2 and drained himself in the process. It seemed he wanted to send a message to Federer that he had the game for a Slam winning career.

Australian Open 2010 - I think this is the first time that Federer was absolutelt brutally destructive of Murray's game. It was a loud clear message that Andy in BO5 format lacks the tools to win a Slam.

Now we saw the Gamesmanship by Federer early in the 2nd set. Now to those who are loyal to the spirit of tennis would it admit that was Faux Pas by the Swiss, but I didn't mind it. Great tennis is often built on rivalries with a little edge and spice to them. McEnroe/Connors, Sampras/Agassi and Lendl/Wilander. It makes for compelling viewing. It carries a pride. Both players can't stand losing to one another.

Roger is often portrayed as quite a calm and ice cold customer. However at times he has shown emotion. Does he show enough to be deemed and emotive player?

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Oct 13, 2012 8:17 pm

Fed is not an ice-cold customer in my opinion.
He is just very, very sharp and able to rein himself well.

Part of fun for me when watching tennis is just to observe what's behind the facade.

You get to know the players quite well like that, their little mannerisms, quirks, how they react against certain players, it's all there to be seen quite easily.

In Federer and Murray dynamics there is no love lost.
If I was a player, I'd dislike Murray as well, he is a turn-off with his c'mons on UEs and his thinly veiled arrogance.

Arrogance suits some people, but not Murray. I noticed it first time and in a very ugly way during a DC match against Austria a few years ago.
Poor Boggo was playing his socks off and nearly beat Melzer, but as he was losing the match what did his bench do: cheer him on like Tipsarevic and Djokovic cheer Troicki, or Nadal and Ferrer cheer Lopez? No he was rolling his eyeballs at Bogdanovic. I really felt for the poor guy.

As a copetitor, Murray is very dogged and that can get on your wick as well as a player, but that's fine.

So, players know and feel all these things better than we do.

I think a lot of players don't like the extra media pushing and molly-cuddling Murray gets all the time.
I bet they're all sick of it just have to shut up about it for the sake of "peace".
Not a big deal, but that's why I think Fed does not particularly get on well with Murray.
I think his relationship with Nole has improved a lot since the early days and is better than that with Murray. There's more mutual respect.

Murray is more buddy with Nadal.

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Oct 13, 2012 8:23 pm

Also, I thnk Fed is quite passionate as a character, just not the expressive kind. They are the worst as they suffer on the inside Federer - Emotive Player? 1071211947
Nole is the opposite.

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Post by legendkillar on Sat Oct 13, 2012 9:35 pm

But then I have to say Murray for me is compelling to watch when he gets fired up. If he swears so be it. To me it shows he cares.

Others try winning the crowd with over posturing which often gets on my tits. If the fans like you they will cheer.

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Post by noleisthebest on Sat Oct 13, 2012 9:52 pm

legendkillar wrote:But then I have to say Murray for me is compelling to watch when he gets fired up. If he swears so be it. To me it shows he cares.

They all care. Foul-mouthing doesn't bother me too much, but I don't like it.
But taste is a funny thing, for example, I love watching Simon and French players when they get upset, I don't understand a word they are saying but they are just cute.
Murray just a turn-off. He is kind of unpleasant and bordering neurotic about it kind of thing. Especially in the past, he's a lot better now.
Ideally, if he could cut it out he'd come across a lot better.
And it does matter how they look on court, because that's why we watch them.
His tennis is a matter of personal taste, and he's not my cup of tea. He is just not elegant enough for me, and started bludgeoning the ball a lot harder now which adds to the lumbersome, worked style he is playing now.

His shots lack grace and spark, they are efficient, but nothing more than that for me. His cross-court backhand is very lethal and not bad to look at, but that's about it from the aesthetic department. All the cat and mouse slicing cross-court just gets boring after one or two points.

He now plays similar style to Nole from time to time, but Nole's ball striking is electric esp when he's on.
Fed I can watch whomever he plays, just like Youzhny, Simon, Tsonga and quite a few other players.

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Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:49 am

Federer is often Calm and composed, but he isn't a robot. He is definitely emotive, it shows when he wins, or loses.

Against Murray they he looks more frustrated than anyone else. Not even Nadal. Maybe he doesn't value Murray as a good enough player against whom he should be losing a match. It shows when he refuses to backs down in a rally, even if costs him an UE. And on days when he is isn't able to play well, those frustrations appear.


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Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:53 am

noleisthebest wrote:
legendkillar wrote:But then I have to say Murray for me is compelling to watch when he gets fired up. If he swears so be it. To me it shows he cares.

They all care. Foul-mouthing doesn't bother me too much, but I don't like it.
But taste is a funny thing, for example, I love watching Simon and French players when they get upset, I don't understand a word they are saying but they are just cute.
Murray just a turn-off. He is kind of unpleasant and bordering neurotic about it kind of thing. Especially in the past, he's a lot better now.
Ideally, if he could cut it out he'd come across a lot better.
And it does matter how they look on court, because that's why we watch them.
His tennis is a matter of personal taste, and he's not my cup of tea. He is just not elegant enough for me, and started bludgeoning the ball a lot harder now which adds to the lumbersome, worked style he is playing now.

His shots lack grace and spark, they are efficient, but nothing more than that for me. His cross-court backhand is very lethal and not bad to look at, but that's about it from the aesthetic department. All the cat and mouse slicing cross-court just gets boring after one or two points.

He now plays similar style to Nole from time to time, but Nole's ball striking is electric esp when he's on.
Fed I can watch whomever he plays, just like Youzhny, Simon, Tsonga and quite a few other players.

I agree completely. I just don't have the taste for Murray's game. All his shots looks worked-up and unnatural to me. They maybe effective, but I don't that's enough reason for me to like it. Playing beautiful is important for me. And we all know about this beauty thing.

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Post by sphairistike on Sun Oct 14, 2012 3:21 pm

Completely agree with ROTLA (and Nitb to some extent Winking)

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Post by Veejay on Sun Oct 14, 2012 3:38 pm

I dont think Roger likes Murrays arrogance,it rubs him up the wrong way
Murrays ego tends to get ahead of itself and Federer likes to remind Murray of his place
Murrays game does however frustrate Roger because it starts making him think too much about Murrays tactics rather then just play freely
I thought AO was a comprehensive dismantling of Murray,and I think he did similar to Murray at Wimbledon,once he took the 2nd set it was all one way traffic
What was the faux pas?

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Post by Tenez on Sun Oct 14, 2012 3:56 pm

I think Federer knows when playing with Murray Djokovic or Nadal what's their strength. He sees Murray's legs and arms, he sees the way he muscles the ball, knows that if Murray had stayed as fit as Jamie his brother, Murray would not even be on the court facing him.

Of course I might be wrong but those guys know more than us and if the guys who retire like Santoro or Rochus talk openly about it, I have no doubt that those still playing think alike but just don't talk.

THat is in my view what may rattle Federer. His gamesmanship might be nothing compared to others.

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Post by Veejay on Sun Oct 14, 2012 8:30 pm

What did Federer do cause I cant remember?
People will always be sensitive and look for reasons to accuse someone of poor sportsmanship like yesterdays match with Murray
That wasnt anything like the way Nadal acted at IW

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Post by laverfan on Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:17 am

LK

Shanghai 2008 is the TMC which was a three-setter - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjTYpAkiCbo

It is also the first time, Federer had a trainer out for his back.

Shanghai 2010 is two-setter. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtRWdLkigCg


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Post by laverfan on Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:57 pm

All of them are emotive. Visible reactions from tiny fist-pumps to lawn-mowers and everything in between just show cases the human aspects of these fantastic athletes.

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