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Monte Carlo

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:27 pm

TMF wrote:
... wrote:I dodn't see the match (just a few points at the very end and in that 15 min long game on Goffin's serve), but sounds like it was ine of thise vintage Nadal matches from hell.
Goffin looked  like played well just was tired from yesterday.
Shame.
What was the score when that bad call was made?
Did it really change anything?
I must say, things like that would drive me mad, you si ply can't prepare for them however hard you try.


It changed everything.

Goffin was leading 3-2 with a break, looking relatively comfortable. It should have been 4-2 but the umpire made them replay a point that was clearly Goffin's and Rafa went on to break serve and then broke serve again to take the set.

Goffin was fuming and couldn't get his act together. The end.

Couldn't he have called a match or tournament superviser?

I read earlier that Nastase was kicked out of a Fed Cup match as Rumania's captain.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Tenez on Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:48 pm

AceofDeath wrote:Awful final for the fans to watch. Still isn't worse than a Djokerray final!
Arguable frankly. This one is even more predictable.

I would have loved to see Federer v Nadal on clay...but hey...looks like it won't ever happen again. Shame cause that's (and was) Federer's only challenge.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Emancipator on Sat Apr 22, 2017 8:03 pm

... wrote:
summerblues wrote:Nitb,

It was a disastrous call.  Goffin is up 3:2 and serving.  Rafa sends a ball long by good 10-15cm (as we can see on HE on TV), linesman calling it out so it is 4:2.  Rafa not challenging but Cedric decides to come down and check the mark.  He then proceeds to pick a wrong mark and declares Rafa's shot good.

Goffin ultimately lost the game and was never same again.  Horrible call.  That said, Goffin should not have allowed himself to be impacted by it so much.  Mistakes do happen and he is a pro.  I suppose easier said than done.

To me that sounds the worst call ever.

I don't know how players can live with themselves like that, eg Nadal.

How can you continue to play knowing you have stolen a point.

I know players do all kinds of stuff in order to win: dope, fake MTOs, but this takes the cake.

And of course, nothing is going to happen...

It makes me sick just to visualise the situation, I can imagine poor Goffin. There is no way you can remain unaffected and control that situation.

Such a shame.

How can you blame Nadal?

He didn't even challenge the initial call of the ball being out - he accepted it - the umpire was the one who instigated everything. You can't then expect Nadal, who's on the other side of the net, to overrule the umpire. That would be ridiculous.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sat Apr 22, 2017 8:07 pm

I didn't realise it was on Goffin's side.
Still, players can easily see an out, and I am sure Nadal knew his shot was out.

I can't imagine Nole pretending it wasn't. Fed usually lets the ump do the job, not sure he'd say anything either.


When you play in practice, it's always a player's call.
They are all used to it.

I am assuming there was a lot of booing.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by legendkillar on Sat Apr 22, 2017 8:13 pm

... wrote:
TMF wrote:
... wrote:I dodn't see the match (just a few points at the very end and in that 15 min long game on Goffin's serve), but sounds like it was ine of thise vintage Nadal matches from hell.
Goffin looked  like played well just was tired from yesterday.
Shame.
What was the score when that bad call was made?
Did it really change anything?
I must say, things like that would drive me mad, you si ply can't prepare for them however hard you try.


It changed everything.

Goffin was leading 3-2 with a break, looking relatively comfortable. It should have been 4-2 but the umpire made them replay a point that was clearly Goffin's and Rafa went on to break serve and then broke serve again to take the set.

Goffin was fuming and couldn't get his act together. The end.

Couldn't he have called a match or tournament superviser?

I read earlier that Nastase was kicked out of a Fed Cup match as Rumania's captain.

I saw Goffin talk to the match referee end of the first set. Blew a lid whilst the referee nodded nonchalantly.

As for Nastase, disgrace of a human being.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:40 pm

Finally saw the clip!
Poor Goffin.



He was actually super composed.
Too composed.

What a vain idiot that umpire is. Or just paid to do it.

That is certainly a possibility.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:43 pm

Disaster, why cant the line judge throw his opinion or umpire go talk to line judge to confirm a half a meter miss? wtf

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:49 pm

Wow!!!
Just saw this, Cedric does seem to have a problem!



Shortly after this incident, Troicki was banned for a year after NOT testing positive.

And not to mention the palaver that surrounded it.

Maybe it was over the top and crazy but I am glad and proud of him for showing Cedric up.

If more players complained like this maybe he would not sit so smugly in his chair chair.

Goffin must be gutted big time!!!

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by summerblues on Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:10 am

... wrote:I know players do all kinds of stuff in order to win: dope, fake MTOs, but this takes the cake.
Fake MTOs and especially doping are far worse than this.  This is not nice, but it is not really cheating.  If umpire makes the decision, it is not the player's responsibility to volunteer the point to the opponent.  Vast majority of them would keep the point (they also all know that their opponents would all do the same).  I am 100% certain Fed would keep it exactly as Nadal did.  Both Fed and Rafa would not only keep the point but also happily use the opponent's irritation to their benefit as best they could.  I am not certain any top pro would have done it differently, and I can think of only a couple who might have conceded the point:  Nole and, perhaps, Tsonga.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Tenez on Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:07 am

From that clip, the referee did not make a mistake, he clearly betrayed his compatriot for the interest of the TD. Once cannot make such a huge mistake. Call against the line judge, the player, and worse, Nadal did not even asked him to check the mark it seems. The least teh referee coudl have done is asked the line judge to point to the mark. He is teh same idiot who accused Davidenko not to "try hard enough".

This is MC, the place where money is everything. They coudl not afford not to have Nadal in teh final.

Awful decision.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:48 am

Tenez wrote:From that clip, the referee did not make a mistake, he clearly betrayed his compatriot for the interest of the TD. Once cannot make such a huge mistake. Call against the line judge, the player, and worse, Nadal did not even asked him to check the mark it seems. The least teh referee coudl have done is asked the line judge to point to the mark. He is teh same idiot who accused Davidenko not to "try hard enough".

This is MC, the place where money is everything. They coudl not afford not to have Nadal in teh final.

Awful decision.

Yes, I thought so, too. Not the first time.

And it's always Nadal who seems to be the most obvious beneficiary.
Let's not forget he even had the power to remove Bernardes from his preferred ump list.

Majority don't see it, thinking tennis is somehow exempt from laws of business.


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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:54 am

summerblues wrote:
... wrote:I know players do all kinds of stuff in order to win: dope, fake MTOs, but this takes the cake.
Fake MTOs and especially doping are far worse than this.  This is not nice, but it is not really cheating.  If umpire makes the decision, it is not the player's responsibility to volunteer the point to the opponent.  Vast majority of them would keep the point (they also all know that their opponents would all do the same).  I am 100% certain Fed would keep it exactly as Nadal did.  Both Fed and Rafa would not only keep the point but also happily use the opponent's irritation to their benefit as best they could.  I am not certain any top pro would have done it differently, and I can think of only a couple who might have conceded the point:  Nole and, perhaps, Tsonga.

Yes, they are horrible, but in a match situation you as a player are at least kind of resdy for it...if you are playing a "super fit" player, or someone who uses MTOs at will you can expect it, prepare for it...not get too shocked.

With line calls like this, you can't prepare, you simply can't do anything about the shock that hits your mind and emotions (and body as a result).
Depending on how emotional you are you may need more or less time to recover.

You can see the difference between how Goffin and Troicki handled it.

Goffin was eaten out on the inside, his upbringing prevented him from exploding.

Troicki got it all out of the system and probably calmed down quicker.

The worst is - the post effect, knowing what goes on, damageing you for when you play the same player or have the same umpire next time.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by bogbrush on Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:22 am

I don't subscribe to a deliberate conspiracy, there's easier ways to influence a match than making yourself look a clot.

He's just an incompetent buffoon who doesn't know how to use his line officials.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by legendkillar on Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:17 pm

I don't go along with it either. I doubt a few people in a room said "oh when you get the chance give Rafa the rub of the green when you can" and at 2-4 down on Goffin adv absolutely know that key decision will lose Goffin the match.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Tenez on Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:18 pm

bogbrush wrote:I don't subscribe to a deliberate conspiracy, there's easier ways to influence a match than making yourself look a clot.

He's just an incompetent buffoon who doesn't know how to use his line officials.

This is one of the best way actually and it worked! Very similar to Karlo suddenly foot faulting in SW19.

It's because most people don't suspect that others can afford to employ those vile tactics.

I might be wrong on that occasion cause we wil never know for sure but this really looks like a robbery to me. Too many clues which don't add up.

The referee did not even try to look at or consider the mark pointed by Goffin.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Emancipator on Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:48 pm

Sounds like we've entered the twilight zone again.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Tenez on Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:09 pm

Well Nadal has declined hey?

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Tenez on Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:20 pm

Nadal 33s on average between points....MC is the most corrupt tournament.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by legendkillar on Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:29 pm

Tuned in to the sight of Nadal picking his arse and crotch. I'd refuse to shake his hand at the net on hygiene grounds alone LaughLaugh

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:51 pm

Talking of shaking hands, dod Goffin shake Maurie's hand after the match?

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:52 pm

Tenez wrote:Nadal 33s on average between points....MC is the most corrupt tournament.
It is. Rotten to the core.
I can't believe I once wanted to go there.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:31 pm

Well, we can bark all day here against Rafa, but he is the clay GOAT, he just got knighted in the Kingdom of Djoko  Laugh

10 titles pretty good.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:32 pm

... wrote:
Tenez wrote:Nadal 33s on average between points....MC is the most corrupt tournament.
It is. Rotten to the core.
I can't believe I once wanted to go there.

Carry Jelena's shopping bag?  Laugh

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:33 pm

... wrote:Talking of shaking hands, dod Goffin shake Maurie's hand after the match?

Nope, just went straight to his chair.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:03 pm

Nadal today:

70 ATP
50 ATP in clay
93% of wins on clay


Go Rafa Go!!!!  Big Grin

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:54 pm

Jahu wrote:
... wrote:Talking of shaking hands, dod Goffin shake Maurie's hand after the match?

Nope, just went straight to his chair.
Good!

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:02 pm

Jahu wrote:Well, we can bark all day here against Rafa, but he is the clay GOAT, he just got knighted in the Kingdom of Djoko  Laugh

10 titles pretty good.
No way is Nadal clay goat, most successful - yes.
Clay tennis is about flair and creativity not bludgeoining.


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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:03 pm

... wrote:
Jahu wrote:Well, we can bark all day here against Rafa, but he is the clay GOAT, he just got knighted in the Kingdom of Djoko  Laugh

10 titles pretty good.
No way is Nadal clay goat, most successful - yes.
Clay tennis is about flair and creativity not bludgeoining.


That coming from a die hard Djoko fan, is preposterous Whistle

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:15 pm

Hehe Yahoo,

I actually think you are the biggest Nole fan around. All this trash anti-Nole talk is just a cover-up. Laugh

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:16 pm

Hahahah, yeah, same as you acting like the Fed's biggest fan since AO, and Djoko falling down.

Drop the Fed love act  Smooch

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by ... on Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:48 pm

Jahu wrote:Hahahah, yeah, same as you acting like the Fed's biggest fan since AO, and Djoko falling down.

Drop the Fed love act  Smooch

You mean you want me to be a Nole fan again?

I think I've done my fair share of fandom. So much nicer to sit back and relax enjoying tennis without blinkers.

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Jahu on Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:52 pm

Yeah, but you and me know that you have not given up on Djoko, though he seems to have given up on everything, was sad to see his parents in one box, team in another, wife in another box, bit of a mess going on.

Idi pomogni malo  Big Grin

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Daniel on Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:51 am

You were wrong yet again, Tenez...  It's an unhealthy habit of yours.  I take a quick peek and it's even more absurd as you are now suggesting Federer's forehand of 2017 is better than 2006.  At least it's one crazy and totally wrong assertion at a time.  Bubbly

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Re: Monte Carlo

Post by Tenez on Mon Apr 24, 2017 8:31 am

Daniel wrote:You were wrong yet again, Tenez...  It's an unhealthy habit of yours.  I take a quick peek and it's even more absurd as you are now suggesting Federer's forehand of 2017 is better than 2006.  At least it's one crazy and totally wrong assertion at a time.  Bubbly
Whereas Nadal winning another MC at 31 nearly, as easily as in the past shows that you were right and he is declining. Doh

Just a summary of 2017 winners:

AO : 35.5yo
Dubai: 29.8yo
IW:35.6yo
Miami:35.5yo
MC: 30.9yo

I am sure you still think Fed's BH was better then. You are in such denial that my pleasure to argue with you is to rub your nose.

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Re: Monte Carlo

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