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La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:28 pm

Tenez wrote: If fresh and younger

Fresh and younger? Fed has been losing to Nadal since he was 23. How much younger you want him to be to be able to Beat Nadal.



Tenez wrote:It's crucial as fed can only afford to run on the very important point limiting him on his shots choice. he is trying his best to keep the rally shorts cause he know he can't afford to keep running.

Tenez, when Fed starts to struggle against Nadal, it starts from the 1st set, maybe the 1st game too. So no freshness, tiredness comes into factor from point-1.

Nadal's heavy spinning loopy LH FH are difficult for Fed's BH on returns and in a rally. Nadal's away going lefty serve is difficult for Fed. And that's the case from point-1. Its a difficult shot for Fed not matter how fresh, young or whether its point-1 or the last [point of the match. No amount of freshness, young age or tiredness plays here. Nadal court coverage and speed doesn't even allow a lot of those BH to be winners. So Fed has to keep doing the difficult thing it over n over.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:28 pm

Daniel wrote:
raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:
Tenez wrote:I think had Fed been fresh today he would have won in 3 straight sets. You coudl tell he was exhausted and trying to play well in patches...and on some others like v Stan or Nishi, he completely lost the plot.

If Fresh he woudl have been deadly.

Fed has lost to Nadal ( some bad ones too) despite being much fresher ( much less time on court ) in past. So I'm not going to be as confident as you are. I don't see freshness factor plays so much importance in their matches.

The important 2 important factors from Fed's side as I see are:


1. Fed's BH on return and DTL. Unless he has it working great( nothing less ) , he has no chance to beat Nadal. In all his wins including today, this shot was working great ( not just good) for him.
2. Fed's serve. It needs to be firing heavy to let him hold comfortably.

i'm with you. Nadal isn't the player he was and Federer isn't either. Mentally, the weakness was there to see and somehow he managed to win that fifth with history and the world saying he wouldn't.  It's probably Fed's last Slam title, and it may even be Nadal's. It will certainly be their last meeting in a Slam final.  Nadal will always have the match up advantage over Federer, especially on clay.

Daniel don't you think you look a bit foolish with players peaking at 26 now? You keep bringing the subject cause you are trying to convince yourself. WEverybody else knows nowadays that players usually peak a few years after that.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:30 pm

Players still peak in their mid 20s. There are other factors which are playing here. I'll wrote about them later.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Veejay on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:45 pm

federer has broken another record,he becomes the first man in history to win 5 or more titles at 3 different grand slams

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by summerblues on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:46 pm

I am so very glad I was so very wrong about this match!

Congrats Roger.  18 and counting.  Unbelievable feeling.

I saw the last two sets and I had the feeling it would be like so many of their other matches - or indeed many of recent Federer's matches against Novak, i.e., Roger winning fair share of points but not the important ones.

Roger had BPs in every one of Rafa's service games in the fifth set, yet when Rafa came back from 0:40 to deuce at 3:4 I was sure he would win once again.

Amazing feeling, unbelievable.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:48 pm

raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:Fresh and younger? Fed has been losing to Nadal since he was 23. How much younger you want him to be to be able to Beat Nadal
I am glad you are finally agreeing to what I have been saying everyday for the last 7 years. Fed was beaten by Nadal cause he did not have the experience and shots to beat him. His BH was shanking after the first sets cause he was getting tired. Now like Stan he has the shots to make Nadal run too and he shanks much less. So my point is and always was that with his today's game and 2006 youth, no one woudl touch him....regardless the surface.



Tenez, when Fed starts to struggle against Nadal, it starts from the 1st set, maybe the 1st game too. So no freshness, tiredness comes into factor from point-1.
This is pretty wrong. Fed has very often lead or won that first set versus Nadal....even in most the matches he lost. I have hilighted it before and you can check very easily. And that is why I was right today in my OP that I expected Fed to win that first set. Which he did convincingly.

Nadal's heavy spinning loopy LH FH are difficult for Fed's BH on returns and in a rally. Nadal's away going lefty serve is difficult for Fed. And that's the case from point-1. Its a difficult shot for Fed not matter how fresh, young or whether its point-1 or the last [point of the match. No amount of freshness, young age or tiredness plays here. Nadal court coverage and speed doesn't even allow a lot of those BH to be winners. So Fed has to keep doing the difficult thing it over n over.
Again I disagree with this.
As I pointed out Fed bagelled Nadal on clay in 2006 and was always able to handle it......for a set or 2....but the problem was that BH was not pacy enough and that meant that Nadal forced him to run and after running YES that BH was shanking, especially on clay. But having a larger frame completely changes the equation.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by summerblues on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:50 pm

I was unable to stay through the trophy presentation.  What is this talk about Fed saying he might not be back next year.  Did he really say that?

That would surprise me.  It strikes me that he loves to play and I would think he will not go away until he feels sure there are no slams left in him.  Clearly, that is not how he will be feeling after today.  Not only did he win, but he won having played three 5-setters, including one against his kryptonite player.

Unless something goes very wrong, I would expect him to stick around at least another couple of years after today.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Jahu on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:52 pm

Let him win another W this year, and he can quit for me.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by luvsports! on Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:57 pm

Lydian wrote:Congrats for your guys win today, Roger really showed great grit and determination. Ok, it obviously wasn't their best match by a long chalk but was a worthy "battle" of what is likely their last great match together. 

For me, when the two stood up there at the end on the podium giving their speeches it felt like tennis royalty right there with Laver combined. For all the arguments back and forth about Nadal and Federer the game will be poorer for their eventual exit and I even got a sense from Federer that this might be his last year when he said he might not be back next year and told Rafa to keep playing on...ie. in his absence...that sounded like a clear signal from a man who knows his time is coming up. And what a way to now go...2017 can be his lap of honour. I really wouldn't be surprised if he calls it a day this month, after Wimb or USO. I don't see him back in tour next year.

The other thing you can palpably sense from the presentation is the warmth and respect between the 2 guys. I know people on here won't recognise that but these guys are actually very good friends and respect each other like no others on tour. After all it was Roger who visited Rafas Manacor academy during his injury period. The tour will miss them both when they're gone. These are the 2 best players to have graced the game in my opinion, for many reasons, they give more back to the game than just about anyone else too and now with today's battle included one player will never be discussed in future without innate reference to the other. They've almost defined the career and success in the other and that sits fine with me if not others.

Yes I'm disappointed Rafa lost but I'm not surprised, it felt like he was hanging on for most of the match and I knew Roger would come back in the 5th. I was on court myself at the time when Rafa was 3-1 up in the 5th and I said to a guy who thought it was over that no, Federer will come back. Rafa simply isn't the player of a few years back and it's tough to see these guys playing post Prime, which is what they are - and yet they still reach slams finals. To be fair Roger employed good tactics, dug deep and refused to roll over. Rafa battled enormously too when he must have frankly been knackered but I knew it wasn't going to be today, that semi took too much out of him, dulled the edges. However I respect Feds hugely, the player he is and what he means to the game. For me no Djokovic or Murray match can hold a candle to the legend of these 2 playing each other, no matter the H2H or whatever the situation, there is no bigger occasion in tennis right now because again they have battled each other for so long now...beating each other since 2004 which is a seriously long time at the peak of tennis. Not many top pairings have done that for 13/14 years in the Open Era. This pair epitomise the yin and yang of tennis and sport itself - artistry, grit, coming back from low periods, never giving up, grace in defeat. I'm not interested in the negatives about Nadal...whatever...any true tennis fan recognises what these 2 players have brought to the sport, the legions of players they have encouraged to pick up a racquet, and they will be a tough act to follow, even for Andy and Djokovic who may play on for a while once these 2 hang up their racquets - which I predict won't be far short of each other when the time comes.

Anyway...enjoy your day guys, your man did good and cements his place in history, as it does the Federer-Nadal duality as mentioned. I know Nadal is hated around here but that's fine, opinions are opinions. I'm come to appreciate that the 2 players longevity in facing each other across so many key moments has defined each others career and I believe both guys are very happy with that label too. As Roger said himself today, a draw would have suited him fine, he knows they have got to a place where they're cemented together in tennis history. I'm sure we'll see these 2 guys together a lot down the years because they are close and recognise what the other means to the game.

So that's it for me posting for a good long while, I haven't posted much recently anyway...my interest has diverted back to playing and coaching the game, its what I enjoy the most so I'll leave you guys to discuss the ins and outs. Enjoy today's W, your guys legend and the lap of honour year ahead, maybe even #19 is possible.

Cheers smiley

Awww come here you! Big Grin
Brilliant post!

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:01 pm

Tenez, you are going to be alone in your theories  about a lot of things on tennis. No tennis experts or anyone or even historic data would share it with you.

You are fine with that, I believe. I'm too fine with it. smiley

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by luvsports! on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:06 pm

summerblues wrote:I was unable to stay through the trophy presentation.  What is this talk about Fed saying he might not be back next year.  Did he really say that?

That would surprise me.  It strikes me that he loves to play and I would think he will not go away until he feels sure there are no slams left in him.  Clearly, that is not how he will be feeling after today.  Not only did he win, but he won having played three 5-setters, including one against his kryptonite player.

Unless something goes very wrong, I would expect him to stick around at least another couple of years after today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upLv0xBTai8

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by luvsports! on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:12 pm

I FEEL A SONG COMING ON!!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M

COME ON PEEPS, WE BEL18VE Big Grin

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by AceofDeath on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:28 pm

Don't really know if Fed should continue playing now, he could retire into the sunset on this win because I believe it will only be down from these amazing 2 weeks.

Enjoy your 18th sir Bubbly Cheers

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by summerblues on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:33 pm

AceofDeath wrote:Don't really know if Fed should continue playing now, he could retire into the sunset on this win because I believe it will only be down from these amazing 2 weeks.

Enjoy your 18th sir Bubbly Cheers
So what if it is all down from here?  I just want to see him play - it is immensely enjoyable even if he fails to win. (though wins do not hurt either. Winking)

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by ... on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:41 pm

gallery play wrote:Biggest fuck up in the history of the earth in the making.

Bye folks, see ya later.

Come back GP! Hug
It is finished. We have seen the peRFect match. No pundid will ever dare say that Nadal is the greatest.
All mouths are stopped for ever now.

The Albatross is flying!

The sky is blue.

He is gliding in the sun.

And right here and right nothing else matters....

P.S.
I'm drinking champagne, floating on the bubbles.... Bubbly


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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by summerblues on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:42 pm

luvsports! wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upLv0xBTai8
Thanks.  Odd indeed.  Still, my first read is to take it at face value.  He hopes to be here next year (i.e., not planning to retire) but realizes that at his age things can happen (like his last 6 months) and that "if" is hopefully just a recognition of that.

I really hope he plays for at least another two years.  Given how well he held up here, I see no reason why he would not still be inside top 10 (and thus with at least some shot at more slams) in two years' time.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:47 pm

raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:Tenez, you are going to be alone in your theories  about a lot of things on tennis. No tennis experts or anyone or even historic data would share it with you.

You are fine with that, I believe. I'm too fine with it. smiley

Well. I dunno what you have been watching recently but the pundits are actually all saying now what I have been saying since 2009!.


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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:49 pm

Jahu wrote:WHo said yesterday if Fed won he wont comment or be here or something?

Tell him to come back smiley
Well hi then!

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Jahu on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:51 pm

Hey GP, welcome back, more wins to come so stay around smiley

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:56 pm

Jahu wrote:Hey GP, welcome back, more wins to come so stay around smiley
Jahu, you tough guy! You stood tall where most of is sneaked out Big Grin

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Jahu on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:00 pm

We all wanted the same result, so all happy today smiley

See you for another title in Dubai!!!

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by ... on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:07 pm

gallery play wrote:
Jahu wrote:Hey GP, welcome back, more wins to come so stay around smiley
Jahu, you tough guy! You stood tall where most of is sneaked out Big Grin
I didn't sneak out.
I go to church at 10.45 every Sunday.

Missed many AO finals like that.

The best bit was that the sermon was on Chirst's last words: "It is finished"

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by raiders_of_the_lost_ark on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:19 pm

Tenez wrote:
raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:Tenez, you are going to be alone in your theories  about a lot of things on tennis. No tennis experts or anyone or even historic data would share it with you.

You are fine with that, I believe. I'm too fine with it. smiley

Well. I dunno what you have been watching recently but the pundits are actually all saying now what I have been saying since 2009!.

Sorry but NO.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:22 pm

I went to the gym when Fed got 0-1 behind in the fifth. When i got back i saw him with the trophy in the arms of Mirka. Anyone else a crush on her too? Winking Her presence in the end was just..heartwarming)

I've just seen a replay of the fifth set, twice. Still can't believe what happened. Not only Fed played his best tennis (when did that happen in a fifth set?) but he did it while the score kept on stabbing his faith. I mean, how many chances can go down the drain before you give up? But he simply didn't gave up. He was prepared to die out there.

However, from the start Nadal did seem beatable to me. I really think Fed held his faith because he saw less balls come back than on other occasions against Nadal. In fact, at times Nadal didn't even get his racket behind some groundstrokes which were not even meant as winners.

But i don't want to take anything away from Fed. The crux of his win was: some solid returning and a blistering BH. NAdal had never dealt with so much power from Fed's BH side.

I underestimated Fed's grid, but hey, who can blame me? I've hardly seen 750 matches of the man... Laugh

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Jahu on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:25 pm

The BH that last 5 years has always been his weak point, won the match today I think, he did not just play the ball with BH over the net, but used it to attack and change directions nicely.

Long live SHBH!!!!

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:31 pm

Yes. And he passed it through to Dimi. The SHBH is as alive as it ever was!

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:33 pm

Tenez wrote:This is by far my best sport experience ever!
Know how you feel, bud

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:43 pm

raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:
Tenez wrote:
raiders_of_the_lost_ark wrote:Tenez, you are going to be alone in your theories  about a lot of things on tennis. No tennis experts or anyone or even historic data would share it with you.

You are fine with that, I believe. I'm too fine with it. smiley

Well. I dunno what you have been watching recently but the pundits are actually all saying now what I have been saying since 2009!.

Sorry but NO.

A 35yo won against his 30yo nemesis today. Those are facts. You might say NO to facts, but that's the reality.

And to be fair I did not expect Fed to win today at the end of teh tournament but one thing for sure I woudl have given him even much less chance with is 2009 BH and serve.


Last edited by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:53 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Jahu on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:44 pm

Since Dimi is a client of Feds Team8 Agency, guess Dimi will get some one2one insight with Fed this year, and hope Dimi can give us a few more GS SF or Finals and a Title.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:57 pm

Jahu wrote:Since Dimi is a client of Feds Team8 Agency, guess Dimi will get some one2one insight with Fed this year, and hope Dimi can give us a few more GS SF or Finals and a Title.
Well, the one on one chat has already taken place, as Fed revealed after his semi. And after that chat Dimi is -according Federer- the hardest working player of the tour.

I definitly think Dimi will get a big one this year.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:58 pm

Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by luvsports! on Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:02 pm

When times are tough this week and my boss is yelling at me, I will go to my happy place and think of this majestic day Big Grin

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:05 pm

Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Jahu on Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:09 pm

Hope Thiem too, to carry the SHBH flag with Dimi.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:10 pm

Don't forget Stan. He has a slam left in him i suppose

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:11 pm

gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking
When he is 30+ ....probably. Winking

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Daniel on Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:44 pm

goo.gl/OmHLSm

Forgot to share it!!!

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Jahu on Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:46 pm

Nice data, thx smiley

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:02 pm

Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking
When he is 30+ ....probably. Winking
You're holding your argument against the wrong poster my friend. 

Or is it you can't approve my take on Nadal today? (being a step slower)
Winking

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:09 pm

Daniel wrote:goo.gl/OmHLSm

Forgot to share it!!!

Good. You should do by weeks at number 1 and then make an overall GOAT ranking.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by ... on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:10 pm

gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking
When he is 30+ ....probably. Winking
You're holding your argument against the wrong poster my friend. 

Or is it you can't approve my take on Nadal today? (being a step slower)
Winking
Maybe Fed's balls made him look slower. As it's meant to happen on fast courts.
You have to admit Fed's shots are quicker than Dimi's.

Dimi is only more consistent, but less bite.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by ... on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:12 pm

luvsports! wrote:When times are tough this week and my boss is yelling at me, I will go to my happy place and think of this majestic day Big Grin
It really was majestic. Bubbly

It's beginning to slowly sink in... Big Grin

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:18 pm

gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking
When he is 30+ ....probably. Winking
You're holding your argument against the wrong poster my friend. 

Or is it you can't approve my take on Nadal today? (being a step slower)
Winking

I know you have been staying out of this argument.

Nadal says he was a bit slower today "but that's normal after a long match v Dimi". So I guess yuo might be right. Personally I only noticed on a couple of points....if that.

In any case I think he was made to look slower cause Federer took the ball considerably earlier than Dimi...and overall much less loopy shots.

Fed executed as good as ever for 3 sets and worse for 2 of them. Why? not sure but he certainly showed today that he has the strongest mind of them all cause winning with such margins requires amazing mental strength. Not comparable with a fit moonballer.

Apparently Ljubo and Severin told him it's all mental! Well when you have his talent...sure the mental side is simply essential.

Tenez

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:20 pm

NITB wrote:Maybe Fed's balls made him look slower. As it's meant to happen on fast courts.
You have to admit Fed's shots are quicker than Dimi's.

Dimi is only more consistent, but less bite.
And now I am reading this. This was my feeling too. Just the first point nadal returned in that very last game when Fed was serving for the match. .....amazing return that requires amazing athletism.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:24 pm

NITB wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking
When he is 30+ ....probably. Winking
You're holding your argument against the wrong poster my friend. 

Or is it you can't approve my take on Nadal today? (being a step slower)
Winking
Maybe Fed's balls made him look slower. As it's meant to happen on fast courts.
You have to admit Fed's shots are quicker than Dimi's.

Dimi is only more consistent, but less bite.
Federer's shots are better, Dimi is a great player, but he's not the new Federer, of course.

I think the AO court speed was ok for Nadal, especially in the evenings. But those 5 hours matches may hurt him these days after all. Like it should.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Daniel on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:28 pm

30+ year olds don't fully recover like they used to. As Nadal just found out.  And Nadal needs speed and stamina to win the majority of his points.  He's toast as he gets older. He's almost toast now.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Tenez on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:32 pm

I am trying to find the serve speed stats of 2009 but to me nadal hits the ball harder on the serve and both wings. I have clocked a few rallies but it is difficult to compare as it seems that Federer plays more cross court himself nowadays taking each others off courts which certainly slows the game yet teh pace of an average rally is faster nowadays than in their 2009 match.

Also Nadal has added 3 grams to his racquet which certainly gives him bore pace. But more importantly....Nadal's BH is clearly so much better now than then.

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by gallery play on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:34 pm

Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking
When he is 30+ ....probably. Winking
You're holding your argument against the wrong poster my friend. 

Or is it you can't approve my take on Nadal today? (being a step slower)
Winking

I know you have been staying out of this argument.
Because i don't see it as black or white as you guys.

Like today: Fed's BH seems better than ever at 35, and Nadal's physique at 30 seemed not as good as it ever was(after a 5 hour match)
Who's right, who's wrong? There is no 1 truth.

gallery play

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by Veejay on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:42 pm

interesting post match interview with euro sport 
federer talking about his mental demons,how he feels like he has overcome them - play the ball not the player 
it really looks like he has a different take on his rivalry with nadal
that was really clear to see in the 5th set
you would have thought that roger would be the one to get really tight and choke but it was nadal instead 
this is a massive victory especially mentally for him and a huge mental blow for nadal as the match was wrapped up and on his racket 
we could be seeing roger bet nadal more often now

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Re: La Finale inattendue!!!! Here we go again!

Post by ... on Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:49 pm

gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:
gallery play wrote:
Tenez wrote:Too loopy shots from Dimi. But he has some power too.
He'll surprise you some more this year
Trust me Winking
When he is 30+ ....probably. Winking
You're holding your argument against the wrong poster my friend. 

Or is it you can't approve my take on Nadal today? (being a step slower)
Winking

I know you have been staying out of this argument.
Because i don't see it as black or white as you guys.

Like today: Fed's BH seems better than ever at 35, and Nadal's physique at 30 seemed not as good as it ever was(after a 5 hour match)
Who's right, who's wrong? There is no 1 truth.
I really think 5 hours vs Dimi was negligible for today's match.

As you agreed,  Nadal looked easier for Fed than Djokovic would have been.

Why is that?

Only because:

balls&court are pacier + Nadal is playing closer to the baseline

I think it's physically more taxing to play 5 hours now than 5 hours in 2009.  Nadal did well to adapt to it and get to the final.
His FH is stingier than ever, also his BH.

The trade off is mental fatigue as this faster play for him is a big change which although has made him an improved player - he is still not comfortable like he used to be in the days of 4m behind the baseline, at best he is now a poor man's Djokovic who has always been comfortable on the baseline so his improvement went into the pace of his shots (more muscle, better timing) and he is able to tire Federer much more efficiently, than this Nadal.
Though, on this court, vs fresh Federer maybe he would have struggled too.


On the other hand, it's self explanatory how much these pacy balls helped Federer.
Without them he'd have no chance.
Old balls sucked life out of him in previous years.

Worst ones were in RG 2015.

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